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Discussion Topic: Final AWN top 40 OH, PA and just for fun NJ
Jeff Sitler added to this discussion on March 31, 2009
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AMATEUR WRESTLING NEWS PREP 40 March 10, 2009
Final Rankings by Bob Preusse
1. Blair Academy N.J.
2. St. Paris Graham Ohio
3. Apple Valley Minn.
4. Central Dauphin Pa
5. Wyoming Seminary Pa.
6. Northampton Pa.
7. Central Mountain Pa
8. Simley Minn
9. Huxley Ballard Iowa
10. Christiansburg Va.
11. St. Mark Del.
12. Brandon Fla.
13. St. Edward Ohio
14. Cumberland Valley Pa.
15. Massillon Perry Ohio
16. Blue Mountain Pa.
17. Montini Catholic Ill.
18. Poway Calif.
19. Clovis Calif.
20. Collins Hill Ga.
21. Lake Stevens Wash.
22. Reynolds Pa.
23. Wadsworth Ohio
24. Buchanan Calif.
25. Wisconsin Rapids Wisc.
26. Wausau West Wisc.
27. Long Branch N.J.
28. Hastings Minn.
29. High Point N. J.
30. Park Hill Mo.
31. Flathead Mont.
32. Billings Skyview Mont.
33. Oak Park River Forest Ill.
34. Grand Island Neb.
35. Crown Point Ind.
36. Goddard Kans.
37. Roseburg Oreg.
38. Waverly-Shell Rock Iowa
39. Iowa City West Iowa
40. Ponca City Okla.
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Discussion Topic: Final AWN top 40 OH, PA and just for fun NJ
Roe Fox added to this discussion on March 31, 2009
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Pretty remarkable separation between Wadsworth and St. Eds given the two head to head dual meet wins Wadsworth had over Eds. I know they laid an egg after the quarters at State but as a team performed well.
Who did Wadsworth lose to in duals?
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Discussion Topic: Final AWN top 40 OH, PA and just for fun NJ
Bob Preusse added to this discussion on March 31, 2009
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well Ohio state tourn was big, hard to reward a team that took only 5th in Div I state behind st Ignatius.
Actually Wadsworth made out very well at #23 after "they laid an egg" as u say.
Thats their reward for winning state duals and beating st Eds twice and Massillon Perry once in duals, otherwise Wadsworth wouldnt be ranked at all--- not a real good Ironman showing either.
a truly great year in PA, alot of talent in PA right now, esp their junior class.
traditionally NJ while a top 3 state with PA & Ohio, NJ doesnt often have outstanding teams like PA & Ohio do (other than Blair which isn't a member of the state assn and doesnt wresle in the NJ state tourn).
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Discussion Topic: Final AWN top 40 OH, PA and just for fun NJ
Jeff Sitler added to this discussion on April 2, 2009
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Win's top 25
WIN’s Team Rankings (March 20 Release)
Rk. School, Hometown Prev. Comment
1 Blairstown, N.J. Blair Academy 1 Made 29th straight Preps crown look easy
2 St. Paris, Ohio Graham 2 Set all-time records with 282 points, 7 champions
3 Harrisburg, Pa. Central Dauphin 4 Strength of field makes 3A three-peat special
4 Apple Valley, Minn. 3 Romped to 3A title, but B. Kennedy made them work
5 Northampton, Pa. 5 Only C. Dauphin's raw power prevented duals title
6 Huxley, Iowa Ballard 6 Stuff of records: 220 points, 9 finalists, 5 champions
7 Mechanicsburg, Pa. Cumberland Valley 7 Anywhere but District 3, they roll
8 Mill Hall, Pa. Central Mountain 8 Altons kept them in the hunt
9 Kingston, Pa. Wyoming Seminary 9 Finished 106 behind Blair, but 99 ahead of rest
10 Christiansburg, Va. 10 D. Carter, Weber highlight 4 champions
11 Inver Grove Heights, Minn. Simley 11 Repeated as 2A state champion
12 Brandon, Fla. 12 At state, 112-189: More champs (7) than losses (4)
13 Wilmington, Del. St. Mark's 13 Followed first dual crown since 2002 with 6 champs
14 Lombard, Ill. Montini 14 Breezed past AA with 4 champs, record 6 finalists
15 Lakewood, Ohio St. Edward 15 13th straight crown their toughest test
16 Wisconsin Rapids, Wis. Lincoln 16 Lubeck's upset win keyed dual state crown
17 Wausau, Wis. West 17 Lost twice to Wis. Rapids by combined 3 points
18 Hastings, Minn. 18 Vaith's huge win at 140 soothed duals absence
19 Schuylkill Haven, Pa. Blue Mountain 24 Second place in that field? Awesome
20 Greenville, Pa. H.A. Reynolds 19 Fell short in individual state, but love that balance
21 Lake Stevens, Wash. 20 King's repeat highlighted 5 finalists, 11 placers
22 Long Branch, N.J. 21 Voted first No. 1 Team in New Jersey award
23 Sussex, N.J. High Point 23 State duals DQ didn't tarnish great season
24 Wadsworth, Ohio 25 Balance led to fifth-place Division 1 finish
25 Massillon, Ohio Perry 25 Finished strong second in Division 1
Individual Rankings undefinedundefined
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Discussion Topic: Final AWN top 40 OH, PA and just for fun NJ
Bob Preusse added to this discussion on April 2, 2009
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WIN not alot of difference really from AWN---- cant agree Montini one spot ahead of st Eds. Yes Montini beat st Eds 34-33 in the Clash, BUT at Ironman st Eds
doubled
Montini's score 143 to 76. Overall edge to st Eds.
i don't see any California teams in WIN top 25--- no respect for Poway, Clovis or Buchanhan.
i don't think Cumberland Valley can justify # 7---
got smoked
in duals by both Northampton & C Dauphin, and was even edged at Mannheim tourn by Reynolds. AWN has CV # 14 which i think is plenty high (even adding back in Mike Evans who was suspended for state tourn).
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Discussion Topic: Final AWN top 40 OH, PA and just for fun NJ
Roe Fox added to this discussion on April 2, 2009
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I think it is clear then that you place a higher priority on tournament results rather than duals. Otherwise the team rankings would not make a lot of sense.
I know you get sensitive and often for good reason due to some unfair critiques. This is NOT a critique but an observation that I really have no position on.
I do think it important to know where your emphasis is in understanding your rankings.
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Discussion Topic: Final AWN top 40 OH, PA and just for fun NJ
Bob Preusse added to this discussion on April 3, 2009
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"I think it is clear then that you place a higher priority on tournament results rather than duals."
----------------------------------------------------
no, both count--- but Montini a mere one point win 34-33 over st Eds in a dual is
Not conclusive
, its very close to a
tossup
result. st Eds
doubling
Montini's point score in the Ironman is a drubbing. Factor both results in and its edge to st Eds, that seems clear to me.
i know the Montini coaches very well, they never said a word to me about the rankings.
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Discussion Topic: Final AWN top 40 OH, PA and just for fun NJ
Scott Shaw added to this discussion on April 3, 2009
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Bob, in your professional opinion, is there a huge difference from #10 to number #40?
I think alot of times people come at you for ranking this team here and that team there and they don't realize, #1 how incredibly difficult it would be to rank the top 40 high school wrestling teams out of the thousands nationwide and #2, just because you have a team ranked, say #13, does not necessarily mean that team couldn't beat the #10 team tomorrow, just that on the day the rankings were set, they looked to be #13. (And I agree with you that dual meet and tourney results need to be factored in when making these rankings and a doubling of team points in a tourney says a lot more about a team and their ability to wrestle the best than a one point dual meet head to head win.)
My point I guess is, you are doing a fine job and I wouldn't want to do it. I will have to hear it from my cousins in PA for at least another year or two apparently. At least the past few years I was able to throw the more AA's up in their faces.
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Discussion Topic: Final AWN top 40 OH, PA and just for fun NJ
Roe Fox added to this discussion on April 3, 2009
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Quote from Bob Preusse's post:
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""I think it is clear then that you place a higher priority on tournament results rather than duals."
----------------------------------------------------
no, both count--- but Montini a mere one point win 34-33 over st Eds in a dual is
Not conclusive
, its very close to a
tossup
result. st Eds
doubling
Montini's point score in the Ironman is a drubbing. Factor both results in and its edge to st Eds, that seems clear to me.
I know the Montini coaches very well, they never said a word to me about the rankings."
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Ed's was beaten twice by Wadsworth. From a head to head standpoint wouldn't that be conclusive? It certainly would have to be if you were comparing individual wrestlers.
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Discussion Topic: Final AWN top 40 OH, PA and just for fun NJ
Bob Preusse added to this discussion on April 3, 2009
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well Wadsworth hard fall on Friday night at state has to be factored in, cant just go on 2 close head to head wins over st Eds. Wadworth cant be rewarded for poor state tourn,
it all counts
, they have to take a hit. st Eds did beat Wadsworth handily at Ironman and at state tourn.
truth be known Wadsworth doing
very well
to end up # 23 after a 5th at state tourn and a finish at Ironman below Brecksville, Troy Christian and U School none of whom are ranked. But Wadsworth taking 9 to state out of MP district was a big plus, too. It all counts.
yep Scott, sometimes not much distance between say 10 and 20 or 7 and 15. But alot of difference between top 3 or 4 and No. 20 thru 40, ALOT !!
This season top 4 Blair, SPG, Apple Valley and C Dauphin PA stood out, they were the class. Then not alot of dif from 5 thru 15. Then imo 16 to 30 pretty close. -------
Between # 10 and # 40 u asked ? Christianburg Va and Ponca City Ok? not alot, no, but a definite difference.
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