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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on December 2, 2007

My first instinct was to see where Ohio State finished which was 7 points away from winning the whole tourney. From that perspective, it's hard not to think that the Bucks were one horse away--specifically a "Colt"--from winning this event.

Having said that, it's not important to win early season tourneys. Prestigious, yes. But their most important function is to give you a sense of where the team stands.

The Big Five--Palmer, Jaggers, Humphrey, Pucillo and Bergman--all performed well including wins against some major competitors. Prior to his finals loss, Jaggers had three pins and a decision which is a heckuva performance. Bergman's win over Sauer--a returning AA--makes clear that he can compete at the highest level of this wt. Pucillo had a terrific tourney until his finals loss to a very tough Tyrel Todd. Still, it's the second loss in a row to a wrestler he appeared to have a handle on prior to nationals last season. I don't know whether or not Pucillo needs extra motivation but he got it last night.

Other Random Thoughts:

1) Enright v Humphrey--The senior Enright has had a solid career but never put together a performance at a major event like we saw out of Humphrey. Big individual wins? Yes. But 3rd in Vegas? No. Humphrey spent this weekend making the case that he is the best 133 for the Buckeyes. Still, you have to assume that at some point Enright will have an opportunity to win back his starting role. So, here's the quandary. What if Enright beats him out yet performs as he has in the past--winning decisions but usually losing to the top twelve guys? Hopefully, the best wrestler will emerge as the starter and perform like a champ.

2) The nice aspect of this tourney was that every starter contributed points to the team's total. Triggas and Johnstone made it to the round of twelve while Weakley went 2-2--as did Picazo. Even Campbell chipped in a win. In that respect, it seems that the staff should have a better sense of what the strengths and weaknesses are of these wrestlers and how to help them become better equipped for the rigors of Big Ten comp.

3) Can this team improve? Again, Vegas provided a measuring stick. But to do well in the Big Ten season--where every meet provides a major test--is going to require a big improvement out of your five non-placers. One key to winning duals in conference is not to give up bonus points.

4) What about Sponseller? All of us looked forward to his rookie season but he got hurt. Now what? No question his presence helps the squad. But, how serious is his injury? It's worse than originally reported -- but has not yet been described as "season ending." Do you rush him back to the lineup? Do you hold him out until next year? And let's just say that prior to January, he's given clearance to practice. How soon does he hit the lineup? Will he be in shape? What will be the risk of re-injury? The Bucks need to proceed cautiously. He'd help--but is it worth the risk?



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Jack Muni added to this discussion on December 2, 2007

I was a little disappointed in the teams performance after the quarters, just a little. I thought Jaggers & Pucillo would win their matches against Mich. guys since Russell was a true freshman & Pucillo had beaten Todd on other occasions ( I had wrote off the NCAA cons. pin of Mike because of possible fatigue at that point in the tournament??). But I also read that the Neb. kid who beat Reece was a Junior College National Champ and the Neb. kid who beat Palmer lost to Dustin S. by a score of 3-1 in 1st rd. of NCAA, so these were 2 pretty good wrestlers, no flukes there. I was pleased w/Triggas win over Cudd (looking forward to the rematch next Mon.) and his progress, along with Weakley (he had a really nice switch-move against Villars, and a few doubles he failed to complete. If he works on his defense a little, he might surprise a few people down the road. Though he'll have a real tough test against Herbst of Wisc. on Mon.)



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Christopher Henderson added to this discussion on December 2, 2007

I wonder if Mike Pucillo is going 174 next season. He looked small against Todd in the finals. I think people might be figuring out how to beat him. Todd wouldn't let him do his headlock and Mikey needs his headlock. I still like his aggressiveness and quickness but he just can't bully guys when he's getting outweighed. I'll bet there's a pretty good chance Pucillo goes 174 next season so he can dodge Herbert and win a national title. Also, that let's Magrum come in and start at 184 for his freshman year, and redshirt his sophomore year with Mikey back up at 184 for his second title. I'm sure the tOSU coaches have already thought this out and are implementing this plan as we speak/type.



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on December 2, 2007

Chris:
Not sure I agree that's the plan. If Pucillo were dropping for next year, then why not this year? Todd is a legit national title contender. I assume the pin happened in OT which means it was a very even match. Pucillo is 2-2 against Todd, 0-2 against Kish (although last match was very close) and 1-0 against Varner (Sr National Finals).



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Nicholas Sestito added to this discussion on December 2, 2007

As for getting a sense of where the team stands I believe they're doing extremely well, it's building off this early tournament success is key.

Bergman has showed he can perform well with some of the best of the big boys and if he keeps this mindset (and doesn't suffer a mental lapse and lose in the first round of the NCAA's) he should go on and win a title.

Pucillo looked like he was being the more offensive throughout but let Todd get in during the 3rd period twice to tie up the score, Pucillo might have been able to pull it out if he had been able to ride him out, but perhaps fatigue settled in?

Palmer lost close matches in general, Lance needs to keep up the improvement he had last year with being able to pull out takedowns on a more consistent basis so he can utilize his punishing top game.

Reece did extremely well for himself, it looked like he just gassed a bit towards the end and his opponent was able to score off of that.

In the Jaggers match with Russell, another one of these close finals bouts, getting reversed was tough as I've seen the possibility of that when he throws his legs in. Those long legs of his are always open to getting grabbed (It happened in this match as well as when Troy Tirapelle beat him in high school). Rolling was a mistake as he got caught and stuck down for 2, nearly 3 backfall points. Hopefully next time around we'll see a different Jaggers dominating the neutral and staying just a bit more conservative on the mat, but only a bit.

Our other wrestlers such as Johnstone and Triggas had solid tournaments and as we enter into more duels they'll adapt and carry over this performance to the Big 10 and NCAA's for some points. Weakly will continue to improve, he's shown he can pull big moves off he just needs to keep his conditioning and be able to defend those leg attacks. Campbell did as well as one would expect for being a true freshmen thrown into the lineup who wasn't a highly recruited wrestler. I was pleased to see that Picazo got some bonus points, but only time will tell if he's ever going to really step up and perform like a 5th year senior.

As for the team as a whole, we should do well and improve on the 10th place finish at NCAA's. I'm proud of where this team is heading, our recruiting class this year not as powerful as the one last year, next year I look for the team to pursue some of the big guns we've got coming up in Collin Palmer and David Taylor.



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Jack Muni added to this discussion on December 2, 2007

2006 Vegas finish-10th with 66 points
2007 Vegas finish- 3rd with 100+ points
<thumbsup>



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on December 2, 2007

Just watched the video of Palmer v O'Connor. Lance got an early first period takedown but gave up an escape and a late td in the same period when he got caught napping. He rode O'Connor for much of the second but gave up a late escape. So, he had choice in the third period and was down 4-2 but had a 1:15 riding time advantage. What would you do?

Lance went down--which I don't think was wise. O'Connor only needed to ride for 16 seconds (and he's good on top) to erase the deficit. Lance got ridden the whole period but got a locking hands call--and lost 4-3.

If Lance had gone neutral to start the 3rd, he would have had a one point deficit due to riding time and 2 minutes to score. Instead, he lost his riding time point and the match. It would be one thing if Lance didn't match up well on his feet---but he'd gotten a TD in the first. He could have gotten another. Why not go neutral, start down 1 pt and have 2 minutes to get a TD?

I'm glad this happened now rather than late in the season. The Bucks staff definitely needs to think through the choice options in these situations.



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on December 2, 2007

Concerning Mike Pucillo...Was conditioning a factor? Not that it is as a big a deal in December as opposed to March, and not that I'm dogging a returning AA...Trust me when I say that there are far fewer people that cannot get enough of Mike P.

I'm doing my best to be objective while watching the video. He finishes two high-crotches early but is unable to finish two later in the match...but then again, in order to not be an apologist for Mike P. (as if he needs one!) I've swung too far in being critical.

Hey Mike, just shut me up by giving another solid performance at Nationals!!! <thumbsup>



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on December 2, 2007

Mark: It's a bit unusual to see someone score two first period takedowns and end up losing--but it happened to both Humphrey (in the semis) and Pucillo.

I think what hurt Pucillo was his inability to ride Todd. If he could wear him out a bit (or just keep him down), his early takedowns would have made the difference. Still, I like the crotch lift finish as it's better than switching double. Pucillo's High C is there all day--he just needs to finish it later in the match (which is harder).

Humphrey got tired against Jordan. Semi matches can be tough if you haven't recovered sufficiently from the weigh-in. Then, again, Jordan was big too. Humphrey lost his aggressiveness later in the match and it cost him. I should also point out that Jordan was allowed to stall on top for the third period. He really didn't try anything other than to sit hard on Hump's hips.

Jaggers could easily have beaten Russell. He should have gotten two backs (memo to refs--reward aggressive wrestling) in the second. He also gave up a late reversal in the second. If he doesn't, he probably wins. And the backs were a function of Russell anticipating Jaggers first move on bottom and catching him. Good lesson to learn.

Russell's excellent but don't expect him to go undefeated and win a national title. He's not that type of good--not yet.



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on December 2, 2007

Final thoughts...Darrion Caldwell and Jordan Burroughs are a nightmare for the "establishment" 149's. Both beat Churella and Burroughs split with Palmer. Neither is a fluke. Burroughs is cat quick and strong with explosive hips. Caldwell is just a freak. He has now gone through Metcalf, O'Connor and Churella like they weren't even there. He easily won Vegas. Guys will make adjustments and upsets do occur. And, ultimately, I still think Dustin's the guy to beat. But the rest of a strong field just got even tougher. Anyone that places at 149 nationals this season will have accomplished a lot.



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Scott Nicola added to this discussion on December 3, 2007

125- Triggas seems to be progessing week to week and even match to match. Gets handled by Flores then comes back to get 4 wins including Cudd before bowing out. Already has wins against Cudd and Purdue, could Triggas be a National Qualifier caliber by the end of the year?

133- Humphrey established himself as a legit AA candidate with his strong 3rd and pin of Ruggirello. Tough competition looms in the OSU wrestling room with Enright but when will this wrestle off take place?

141- It sounds like Jaggers was fantastic racking up the pins. Were these pins via cradle? Lost to fantastic Michigan freshman in the finals. Can Jaggers win the rematch?

149- As if 149 was not ridiculously loaded enough up steps Darion Caldwell and Jordan Burroughs. Palmer loses to O'Connor in a real tight one and splits with Burroughs. Who you favor in Palmer vs. Caldwell?

157- Nice run by Johnstone falling one match short of placement. Seems to have adjusted to the weight and is competing well. Can he score points for the Bucks at NCAA?

165- Campbell has been shown progress every week and contributed a win in Vegas. Can he work himself into the Buckeyes future plans for 165/174? The big question at this weight is the health/status of Sponseller. Obviously, it would have been interesting to see him compete against the Vegas group. Redshirt talk making me nervous, I say if he's healthy wrestle him.

174- Picazo conributed some wins at Vegas. Can he adjust to the weight and step it up in March?

184- Pucillo's leg attacks were really nice but he did have trouble finishing late. I attribute this more to Todd being a freakin beast and having a little more horsepower at that point in the match (Pucillo imo the better technician). Can Pucillo reverse the recent trend against Todd?

197- Another freshman with tons of potential if he can stay healthy and continue to improve Can Weakley qualify and score points at nationals?

285- Bergman answered questions about his ability to compete against top notch 285's with his win (incidentally I thought Sauer was stuck after the headlock). Would have loved to see him go at it with Dlagnev. Do we see an all Ohio final at 285?



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on December 3, 2007

Quote from Scott Nicola's post:

"125- Triggas seems to be progessing week to week and even match to match. Gets handled by Flores then comes back to get 4 wins including Cudd before bowing out. Already has wins against Cudd and Purdue, could Triggas be a National Qualifier caliber by the end of the year?"


Yes

Quote from Scott Nicola's post:

"133- Humphrey established himself as a legit AA candidate with his strong 3rd and pin of Ruggirello. Tough competition looms in the OSU wrestling room with Enright but when will this wrestle off take place?"


Who knows?

Quote from Scott Nicola's post:

"141- It's sound like Jaggers was fantastic racking up the pins. Were these pins via cradle? Lost to fantastic Michigan freshman in the finals. Can Jaggers win the rematch?"


Jaggers can definitely beat Russell.

Quote from Scott Nicola's post:

"149- As if 149 was not ridiculously loaded enough up steps Darion Caldwell and Jordan Burroughs. Palmer loses to O'Connor in a real tight one and splits with Burroughs. Who you favor in Palmer vs. Caldwell?"


Caldwell--although Lance's style will keep it close

Quote from Scott Nicola's post:

"184- Pucillo's leg attacks were really nice but he did have trouble finishing late. I attribute this more to Todd being a freakin beast and having a little more horsepower at that point in the match (Pucillo imo the better technician). Can Pucillo reverse the recent trend against Todd?"


Pucillo can beat anyone not named Jake Herbert but he'll have to improve his riding and tighten up his finishes.

Quote from Scott Nicola's post:

"285- Bergman answered questions about his ability to compete against top notch 285's with his win (incidentally I thought Sauer was stuck after the headlock). Would have loved to see him go at it with Dlagnev. Do we see an all Ohio final at 285?"


Why didn't Bergman throw in double grapes?



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Dan Ransick added to this discussion on December 3, 2007

I think you look at the Enright and Humphrey scenario like this, you have to go with the guy that will score you the most points in a real match. Enright may have Humphrey's number to style but Humphrey showed us what he can do out in Vegas picking up a pin of Ruggirello. You go with him since he is the hot wrestler.



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Roe Fox added to this discussion on December 3, 2007

Dan: I understand your point but you open up an interesting can of worms if the senior beats the underclassman in a wrestle-off and you don't wrestle him. I doubt that happens.



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Discussion Topic: Some Thoughts on Vegas
Dan Ransick added to this discussion on December 3, 2007

Wrestle-offs in college aren't like they are in high school you may be able to beat a guy in the room but if you can't produce some big wins you aren't going to be wrestling.



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