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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Pat Altvater added to this discussion on October 23, 2014
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I find different rankings to be interesting to compare.
In this case, I am fascinated by the fact that InterMat ranks Minnesota #1 and OSU #2 in both their tournament and team dual rankings. While Minnesota is a talented team, with a great coach, I can't follow the logic of why Minny is ranked #1 here compared to how they have ranked in the individual classes.
As we all know, Minny will face OSU on the mat in January, so we will see who the best team on the mat is, but for now I would like to compare the two squads and their individual rankings on InterMat.
125 - Nathan Tomesello (11)OSU vs. Sam Brancale (UR)Minny
133 - Chris Dardanes (3)Minny vs JDJ (7)OSU
141 - Logan Stieber (1) OSU vs Nick Dardanes (4) Minny
149 - Hunter Stieber (4) OSU vs. UNRANKED Minny
155 - Ness (1) Minny vs Josh Demas (7) OSU
165 - BoJo (13) OSU vs UNRANKED Minny
174 - Logan Storley (1) Minny vs Mark Martin (11) OSU
184 - Courts (7) OSU vs Pfarr (15) Minny
197 - Schiller (2) Minny vs. Snyder (7) OSU
285 - Tavenello (10) OSU vs. Kroellis (20)
If you break down the match simply by IM's individual rankings:
Minny Wins: 133/155/174/197 - 4 Wins
OSU Wins: 125/141/149/165/184/285 - 6 Wins
I know that we could argue that some of these matches may not be won by the higher ranked individual wrestler, but my point here is that IM's individual rankings project OSU to win 6 out of the 10 weight classes, yet they rank Minnesota as the #1 Dual Team, and rank OSU as the #2 Dual Team. I do not see that logic when I look at these individual rankings.
It seems to me that Minnesota is being ranked #1 here more on reputation than actual match-up comparisons.
I am anxious to here others opinions on this matter.
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on October 23, 2014
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Do Ness and Demas know about the adjustment?
#FightThePower
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on October 24, 2014
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I think tOSU is a bit overrated at this point by the rankers. It's not that they can't do it but let's see it first.
Has anyone noticed how many Kent wrestlers are in the top 20? If accurate, KSU has a really nice team even without Wheeler.
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on October 24, 2014
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Hank...The general consensus is that Jordan and Snyder are being undervalued, I'd be interested to know where you think the rankers are giving Ohio State too much credit?
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Pat Altvater added to this discussion on October 24, 2014
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Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:
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"Hank...The general consensus is that Jordan and Snyder are being undervalued, I'd be interested to know where you think the rankers are giving Ohio State too much credit?"
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I would like to think that Johnni DiJulius and Nathan Tomasello are undervalued at this point also.
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Patrick Campbell added to this discussion on October 24, 2014
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I don't think the individual rankers are overvaluing the Buckeyes at all. I think they are being pretty fair with the attitude of "prove yourselves and we'll move you up."
And while I agree with Michael that those 2 guys are probably undervalued in the rankings at the moment, I do not think it is a bad thing. Even if they both were to make it into the national finals in March, they don't need to enter the season with that pressure. They need to earn every victory and fight to make it to the top. As I like to say, "The onus is on their shoulder to prove their worth." After Cliff Keen, we'll have a much better idea of their strengths and weakness against top level D1 competition. Then we can fairly debate where any of them should be ranked.
Pat, I think NaTo is probably a little undervalued. But, the top guys at 125 are tough and he needs to knock some of those guys down to garner a better ranking.
As for JDJ, he has some things to prove as well. While he had some HUGE victories last season (Joe Colon)...he had some tough losses down the stretch. I like his rankings in the 8-12 range for now. I do think he has a great shot at the podium if he has further developed a few things since March. The good news, he has a great attitude and is the kind of kid that is working to get better. And he is surrounded by guys that will make you better if that is your desire. He has to show us some stuff during the grind of the B1G season when things are the toughest and then I would be more willing to move him higher up.
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Jason Russell added to this discussion on October 24, 2014
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Pfarr at 184 is underrated. Super tough.
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on October 25, 2014
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Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:
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"Hank...The general consensus is that Jordan and Snyder are being undervalued, I'd be interested to know where you think the rankers are giving Ohio State too much credit?"
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Not speaking individually. But I'd have the Bucks no higher than third because of the experience returning at both Minny and Iowa.
The Bucks have proven wrestlers in Hunter and Logan. There's not one other guy on this roster that has ever placed top 8 at NCAA's. BoJo, Snyder and NaTo are all very exciting prospects but that's it for the moment. And Tomasello is no "shoo-in" to AA at a tough 125 weight class.
Then, the Bucks have Tavanello, JDJ, Demas, Courts and Martin. All solid guys that are proven talents but none have placed at NCAA's.
I see four guys on the Bucks that I really like to AA, a few more with a solid shot to do it and then lots of possibilities. Is that the 2nd best team in the country?
I love the upside. I'm excited for the season. But we'll find out what's really going on in Jan and Feb when the Big Ten duals begin.
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
John DiJulius added to this discussion on October 25, 2014
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Quote from Patrick Campbell's post:
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"
As for JDJ, he has some things to prove as well. While he had some HUGE victories last season (Joe Colon)...he had some tough losses down the stretch. I like his rankings in the 8-12 range for now. I do think he has a great shot at the podium if he has further developed a few things since March. The good news, he has a great attitude and is the kind of kid that is working to get better. And he is surrounded by guys that will make you better if that is your desire. He has to show us some stuff during the grind of the B1G season when things are the toughest and then I would be more willing to move him higher up."
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Well said!!
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Patrick Campbell added to this discussion on October 25, 2014
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I'm on your side dad. Love the kid!
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Patrick Campbell added to this discussion on October 25, 2014
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BTW, what I think is always difficult about these discussions is that we have 2 different groups of "fans" talking about a topic. One is no better or more correct than the other. But they have completely different perspectives. The strength of this site is not only accountability, but accountability with a mix of opinions of pure fans and former collegiate wrestlers. The reality is, the truth generally does lie in the middle of our (often) extreme differences in opinion. It's also why I don't get mad or irritated at opposing views. I may defend my point, but the differences never leave me thinking poorly of anyone.
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Pat Altvater added to this discussion on October 25, 2014
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I can't believe M-Rod is supporting Buckeyes on this thread?
Did hell freeze over when I wasn't looking?
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Patrick Campbell added to this discussion on October 25, 2014
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Quote from Pat Altvater's post:
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"I can't believe M-Rod is supporting Buckeyes on this thread?
Did hell freeze over when I wasn't looking?"
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That's 2 different threads with that quote today :-D
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on October 25, 2014
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While I'm not a "fan" of Ohio State, I've watched most of these wrestlers for years and I love that I get to watch them have success at the next level. It's hard not to root for them as individuals after watching them has high schoolers...and I'd be watching Snyder with great interest regardless of what school he chose. He's just that kind of talent that any fan of the would want to watch.
I will say that part of me is pulling for the Buckeyes to win the title. It's been a long time coming and Coach Ryan and Coach Rosselli have done all the right things. It's good for college wrestling to have a real dog fight in the team race. It's a new era where there are a handful of the teams can win every year. And Ohio State should be one of those teams every year. High school wrestling is just too good in this state and there's just too much culture here for the flagship university not to be in the think of the national title hunt year in and year out.
I for one, am truly excited to watch this season play out.
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Discussion Topic: OSU ranked #2 in both duals and tourney on new InterMat Rankings
Justin Hayes added to this discussion on October 26, 2014
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Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:
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"While I'm not a "fan" of Ohio State, I've watched most of these wrestlers for years and I love that I get to watch them have success at the next level. It's hard not to root for them as individuals after watching them has high schoolers...and I'd be watching Snyder with great interest regardless of what school he chose. He's just that kind of talent that any fan of the would want to watch.
I will say that part of me is pulling for the Buckeyes to win the title. It's been a long time coming and Coach Ryan and Coach Rosselli have done all the right things. It's good for college wrestling to have a real dog fight in the team race. It's a new era where there are a handful of the teams can win every year. And Ohio State should be one of those teams every year. High school wrestling is just too good in this state and there's just too much culture here for the flagship university not to be in the think of the national title hunt year in and year out.
I for one, am truly excited to watch this season play out."
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"Come to the Dark Side, Luke..."
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