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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Brian Nicola added to this discussion on February 6, 2017

We've done this before.

Have we, the 40-50 year old wrestling fan, elevated late 80s Ohio legend Alan Fried to godlike status? I still consider him to be the most dominant Ohio high school wrestler ever, but am I looking through a blurred lens?

There are so many amazing guys that have rolled through. So, why does Fried tend to stick out for so many people?

Here's a starter course for those that don't know: http://www.ohiowrestlingsite.com/329/alan-frieds-interview-with-ohio-wrestling-site/

Discuss.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Bill Splete added to this discussion on February 6, 2017

Brian,

Alan was so unique for how hard he wrestled and how polished his technique was at a very young age, thats what got him 3 state titles(he worked out with Joe Gonzales in high school, at time on Olympic team) He always pushed to be the best winning 4 junior titles, still never done, a espoir title(junior worlds now) NCAA champ. He wrestled John Smith in high school, lost 12-4,(think its accurate). He not only wanted to the best he sought out the competition to be the best. There is something very tough about that time period that doesnt exist as much now as then, a hard nosed physical style, a gabe dean style, not flashy, stays in great position. St. eds had it in spades back then, a lot of programs did. We know the greats today, but could they handle that great defense, blocking, and offense. Here is the closest today I get to the two different periods in styles, Kyle Dake vs David Taylor, that would be Al, great position, great blocking/defense, and could score, no rose color glasses, kemp, Al, Jim Jordan, They are a handful today, imagine them being hungry to win, They all could score, but you rarely scored on them, at all levels, cant say the same of all our greats today.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on February 6, 2017

OK, I want to start off by saying I was (still am) a huge fan of Alan Fried. I have tremendous respect for his career. I recognize that he's forgotten more about wrestling than I will ever know. I remember being at the North Canton Hoover open tourney in the summer heading into his senior season and he showed up to wrestle, it was like Van Halen had just entered the building. He was dynamic, hard-nosed and dedicated. Watching him wrestle, whether at St. John Arena or Solon's open mats, was always educational and entertaining. It's also worth noting, that I don't think the guy ever cut a pound in high school. He was tiny as a freshman 98lber, an undersized 112 as a sophomore, he was ranked at 130 his junior season and won the title at 135 and he wrestled 140 as a senior (was 134 three years later to OSU). For a long time I viewed him as the greatest wrestler in Ohio's storied history.

That being said...

Looking back on it, it gets harder and harder to justify. It conspicuously becomes more about an "eye test", a feeling I had when I watched him and less about results. Three titles, not four (and one of those titles was an OT thriller won on stalling calls and conditioning rather than dominant technique), one undefeated season (and while St. Edward always wrestled a great schedule, there was no Ironman...no St. Paris Graham to challenge them in state.). 3X AA and 1X NCAA champion.

Compare that to Logan Stieber or David Taylor...or even Jaggers and Schlatter? What about Dean Heil? Is Fried even the best from his own high school anymore? 4X champ in high school, a likely 4X AA and multiple time NCAA champion.

I agree with the toughness argument. The sport has changed a little, but I don't think that makes up for the difference in record with some of the more recent guys. It's a short list, and Fried is certainly on it, but not at the top anymore.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Bob Preusse added to this discussion on February 6, 2017

kind of forgotten, but looking at st Eds only, Ryan Bertin had perhaps the best college career: 2 NCAA titles, a third and a lower AA place -- two time champ, 4X AA. His senior year in high school he was completely dominating too, not his entire hs career but his senior year as i recall he was the best hs wrestler in the nation.

i'm not geting into "the best" debate, just bringing up a somewhat forgoten guy who ranks right up there near the top for best college career by an ohio wrestler.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on February 6, 2017

A few thoughts concerning Fried

1) he's a bad man. No one doubts that.
2) I'm pretty sure he teched someone good (like REAL good) while in high school.
3) I don't understand how Shameal Patty (sp?) did it. (It = kept it close.) anyone remember him?
4) Kolat, when asked by Jason Bryant, stated that Fried was the best (domestic) wrestler he'd ever seen. (It was SUH-WEEEEEEEEET to see those two embrace in #Cleveland at the NWCA All-Star Classic.)
5) speaking of Cary Kolat, were he and Kolat in different weight classes? They seemed to be in the same era around the same weight classes.
6) Fried coaches HS up in Medina now
7) I went to a clinic at Canal Winchester that he was the feature clinician. I remember a handful of things. One of them was the amount of dodgeball played. Easily 45 minutes.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on February 6, 2017

#2...He tetched Tom Brands in high school. What a difference a couple years with Dan Gable does. It was like a 18 point swing.

#3...Pattie didn't just keep it close. A strong argument can be made that Pattie was the better wrestler that year. Remember, Pattie MAJORED Fried in the Mentor diagonals that year and lost a nail-biter in the state finals. Fried was also helped out in that bout by some stalling calls. Side note, Pattie (Elyria) was only a junior that year. He only wrestled about half the season his senior year. Grades, behavioral issues if I remember correctly. The kid had limitless potential.

#5...they were roughly the same size, but a few years apart. Fried went 98, 112, 135 and 140 in high school and 134, 134, 142 in college. Kolat went 119, 125, 130 and 135 in high school and 134 the first three years of college and the 142 as a senior. Side note, he beat Ohio guys for both of his titles.

Fried graduated in '89, Kolat in '92 (I think). That means the year Kolat burst onto the college wrestling scene was the year Fried had to sit for OSU's violations.

#6...Fried coaches at Medina Highland, a school with a rich wrestling history. They owned the Suburban League before Wadsworth.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on February 6, 2017

Solid.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Bill Splete added to this discussion on February 7, 2017

Mike,
I think your right about the Iowa thing, that was a heart breaker for him, he was Iowa through and through, and they took his scholarship, real dick move by gable. thats why he went to Okie state.

those where some deep, talented weight classes back then, the kids today have better skills, but those were some bad dudes back then, from top to bottom

Bob, i hear Ryan came out of retirement a few years ago to wrestle one match, against an Olympian. Had a ref and everything, word is he was the winner. that kid was great,



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on February 7, 2017

Quote from Bill Splete's post:

"...those where some deep, talented weight classes back then, the kids today have better skills, but those were some bad dudes back then, from top to bottom..."



The depth of high school wrestling was different back then. Think of the talent Alan Fried went through...Names like Elsass, Priebe, Nelson, Emmerling, Pattie, Pergram, Deikun, Kinter, Petche, Manning, Andrassy, Gilmor, Robbins, Orolin, Pinckney, Berdysz. Thise guys were some hard nosed wrestlers, back when North East Ohio Wrestling was the stuff of legends.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on February 7, 2017

He also hammered two time state champ Greg Genovese, Solon.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on February 7, 2017

Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:

"He also hammered two time state champ Greg Genovese, Solon."



Good one Hank...Medina Finals Fried's senior season, bumped up to 145. It was a thrashing that was so horrible that Genovese completely lost it and tried to break Fried's thumb. He got DQed when down big. Later that season he would beat Josh Robbins in the state finals.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on February 7, 2017

Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:

"

Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:

"He also hammered two time state champ Greg Genovese, Solon."



Good one Hank...Medina Finals Fried's senior season, bumped up to 145. It was a thrashing that was so horrible that Genovese completely lost it and tried to break Fried's thumb. He got DQed when down big. Later that season he would beat Josh Robbins in the state finals."



That's correct. Trivia question--who finished 3rd at 145 that season behind Genovese and Robbins?



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Brian Nicola added to this discussion on February 7, 2017

Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:

"

Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:

"

Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:

"He also hammered two time state champ Greg Genovese, Solon."



Good one Hank...Medina Finals Fried's senior season, bumped up to 145. It was a thrashing that was so horrible that Genovese completely lost it and tried to break Fried's thumb. He got DQed when down big. Later that season he would beat Josh Robbins in the state finals."



That's correct. Trivia question--who finished 3rd at 145 that season behind Genovese and Robbins?"



It was actually really fast, too. I watched it live. I feel like Fried took him down right to his back and Genovese lost his composure. I am almost sure the DQ happened within the first minute. And Genovese was a 2xer.

My favorite memory about Genovese was that he would tape his wrestling shoes like an NFL player....like spats.



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on February 7, 2017

Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:

"...That's correct. Trivia question--who finished 3rd at 145 that season behind Genovese and Robbins?"



I can'r believe I can't remember this. St. Edward had a good 145 that year, Elbin. Ramirez from Freemont Ross was really good. Didn't shaker have a solid 145-pounder that year???



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Discussion Topic: The Apotheosis of Alan Fried
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on February 7, 2017

Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:

"

Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:

"...That's correct. Trivia question--who finished 3rd at 145 that season behind Genovese and Robbins?"



I can'r believe I can't remember this. St. Edward had a good 145 that year, Elbin. Ramirez from Freemont Ross was really good. Didn't shaker have a solid 145-pounder that year???"



Good enough. John Smith, Shaker Heights, ended up 3rd at 145. John was very strong and rode legs hard. His offense was lousy but if he could lock his hands around your leg, he'd finish. His favorite Td was to shoot a bad firemans, keep the overhook while on his knees, then force a short arm (sucker drag) drag. Then the boots came in. He was 0-0 at the end of the first period with Robbins in quarters but got hammered while on bottom. Then he rattled off three wins.



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