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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Jack Muni added to this discussion on January 21, 2018
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I felt bad for Nate. Had a couple TD's slip away from him that could have won the match. I wonder if the coaches will have Nate go neutral the next time they meet. The worst part about the loss is the Big Ten seeding will mean he will probably have to go through both Lee & Suriano to win the title, but if he won today Lee & Suriano would meet in the semi's, but now Nate will probably have to go through Lee to get to Suriano, unless something crazy happens in the weeks leading up to the Big Ten tournament.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Chris Shepherd added to this discussion on January 21, 2018
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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Quote from Mike Taylor's post:
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"If there's one thing I might criticize in a 22-12 win over the #4 team was our inability to close out the bonus point wins in multiple situations. 133 we were a takedown away from bonus. 174 we were a takedown away from a major before surrending the takedown at the end. 184 we were well on our way to the tech before Bowman got the late takedown and nearly put Martin on his back with the nearside cradle. Yes, this is nit picking. In most years those things wouldn't matter. However, it is well documented that the team need to collect as many bonus points as they can as the season progresses. So, this match will give Coach Ryan plenty of coaching points and give the team something to work on. It's really nice to win soundly over a surging Iowa squad and be able to whine about bonus points."
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Good point about bonus. Hindsight alert--our bottom wrestling proved suspect. One wonders how Nate's match might have gone if they'd gone neutral to start the second. Bo Jordan's momentum was stymied by a struggle on bottom. He should have earned a major. Same for Myles. He was on his way to a TF.
If nothing else, this dual showed a real weakness on bottom which Iowa exploited. Live and learn but hopefully improve in that position. Or don't take bottom if you don't have to. Either/or."
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One could even say the match was closer than everyone anticipated as a result of those things and the Lee/Nato upset. It's kinda like we were wrestling against a storied program that conceded nothing to us, regardless of rankings?
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on January 21, 2018
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Clearly, Ohio State has some issues getting out off bottom...that being said, this was a good performance by the Buckeyes. I’m sure tOSU fans would’ve liked to see Tomesello come out on top tonight, but this isn’t the bout that Tomesello dropped to 125 for. He dropped for the semifinals and the finals of the NCAAs, period. Think about it, he’s been undefeated the past two seasons, only to drop a match in the semis to a wrestler he’d beaten earlier in the season. The “only†title Tomesello’s won in college was after dropping a bout here or there (only to the very best) in the regular season. He is right there with three other great competitors who can win the crown. Nothing about today’s match lessens his chances of finishing off his career with bookend titles.
The next two weights Ohio State did exactly what it was supposed to do. Pletcher was active and aggressive and so was McKenna. And they did it against wrestlers who went out there to avoid getting bonused. I thought both looked good.
Hayes and Jordan were both out-matched by the second best guys in their weights. Both fought for seven minutes and scored on their opponents. Neither did anything to make me think they’re not All American material. Campbell, it seems, is really good, but on this team is a step below the rest of the squad. That’s not to say he can’t AA or that (if tOSU wins a team NCAA title), he’ll play a big role. But things would have to fall just right or he would ya e to get hot. Who knows? Teams get hot, go on a roll, he’ll be in the blood round. Side bar, how about the season Marinelli’s having, huh?
174, Bo wrestled great. He came out strong, looking to score. I liked what I saw. Same with Martin. You’re not gonna bonus or tech everybody at the Big Ten level. Both were dominant and superior and showed it. Moore’s match wasn’t nearly as close as the score, and that against a wrestler he may see deep into the NCAA bracket. I, for one, liked that he chose neutral in the third. Did it make the match seem Closer than it was? Yes. Did it change the way he wrestled? No. Other Buckeyes may want to ask themselves if that point (or, more accurately, the chance at getting that point) is worth the risk and the effort. Just one guy’s opinion, and I’m wrong a lot.
Kyle Snyder is amazing. What a gift it’s been to watch him compete. I would’ve loved to watch a Snyder/Stoll bout, I don’t think it would’ve been a significantly different bout. I suspect Tom Brands agrees with me (on the outcome, not the desire to watch it).
Long story short, this was a good day for Ohio State wrestling. They beat the crap out of an Iowa team that was peaking. I love the high standards fans, but these guys are good, really good, NCAA championship good. This is what it looks like. Will they win it? I don’t know, but nothing we’ve seen tells me that they can’t. I see Penn State as a slight favorite, but within the margin of error. The Penn State team that just wrestled Michigan looks a little more top heavy, but a little less deep. Only two teams are in the hunt to win it, and you’re team is one of them.
Good time to be an Ohio State fan.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Matt Mace added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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I'm not a Brand's Brothers fan - but they are entertaining. Terry getting into it with the crowd made me chuckle.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Mike Taylor added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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Good post Mike.
One thing I'll add to your post, since you brought Marinelli up, is it appears to be an Ohio thing with regards to lacking mat wrestling. Just like NaTo and Micah, Marinelli was ridden like a rented mule. While I believe his takedowns will keep him above the majority of the field, as we saw with NaTo (and with Micah 2 years ago), mat wrestling can be what keeps a very good wrestler off the podium (Sponeller).
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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Great post M-Rod. Your insights--esp. those w/regard to Nate--are on the mark. Overreactors such as myself need to read such wise words.
Mike Taylor's bottom wrestling comments are also interesting.
In fairness to Te'Shan Campbell, it seems obvious his knee is an issue. Hopefully it can heal up.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Alex Creech added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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Quote from Brady Hiatt's post:
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"I'm not a Brand's Brothers fan - but they are entertaining. Terry getting into it with the crowd made me chuckle."
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what about their antics running up and down the side of the mat? or Sorenson running off the mat before the ref can raise his hand? or marinelli intentionally bumping Campbell on way back to center? or bowman chucking martin's head gear? I guess this is all standard for iowa
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Mike Taylor added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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In some ways, I'm torn on the Brands brothers. During the years I lived in Cedar Rapids, IA, I went to a number of Iowa wrestling matches. On a few occasions, I had the pleasure of meeting and speaking with Tom Brands after the match. He's a very nice guy who has that subtle and dry humor about him.
Virtually every match would contain Tom and Terry doing their requisite sprint along the edge of the mat, stupid chopping of the feet, or any number of other odd mannerisms. Those didn't bother me as much because that is who they are. It is authentically them. What bothers me are the Brands "wannabe's" (i.e. Morningstar, Schwab...he was the worst, Zadick, and Eustice). Each of these guys would mimic the actions of the Brands. It was like a bunch of kids copying what their dad(s) does/do. Instead of a coaching staff it resembled something more along the lines of wrestlers coaching each other and the adults stepping outside for a smoke. I rolled my eyes every time I saw it. The Iowa faithful ate it up.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Jim Behrens added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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My Tom Brands story goes back about 5 or 6 years. I was doing the Iowa at University of Buffalo dual meet. I had never met Tom Brands in my life but he came over to me, shook my hand, and says "Hi, I'm Tom Brands".
My thought as we shake hands is "no $hit, who doesn't know you?".
Believe me, up close those eyes are fairly intimidating.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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Quote from Alex Creech's post:
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Quote from Brady Hiatt's post:
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"I'm not a Brand's Brothers fan - but they are entertaining. Terry getting into it with the crowd made me chuckle."
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what about their antics running up and down the side of the mat? or Sorenson running off the mat before the ref can raise his hand? or marinelli intentionally bumping Campbell on way back to center? or bowman chucking martin's head gear? I guess this is all standard for iowa"
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Matside antics - doesn't bother me. Just don't come onto the mat.
Sorenson - Not my cup of tea but really don't care.
Marinelli - See Sorenson answer.
Bowman chucked his shoe - probably po'd because it coming off allowed for MyMar to get the reversal.
The ref didn't call anything on any of these.
I feel same way about whenever any pro player gets a first down, drops the ball, jumps 3-4 yards downfield and makes the "FIRST DOWN" sign. No my cup of tea but whatever.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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Mike...first off, you’ve got to throw Gilman in with that list. Second, I’d take your “copying Dad†theory one step further. I have always seen The Brands brothers as doing their best Dan Gable impression. Granted, a lot was lost in translation, but they tried to emulate The Master. These kids are a copy of a copy. They look like idiots trying to be something they’re not.
Since Spencer Lee signed at Iowa I’ve wondered if he’ll drag the program away from another generation this crap or toward his quiet confidence and stellar technique...and the winning that goes with it. We shall see.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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Mike - Hearing stories about when the Brands where still in HS - I think they were always crazy / wired / amped up etc. I think they only emulate Gable in fist in the air "he's stalling" calls.
I was to far away to hear - but would love to have heard what the coaches yelling back and forth to each other.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Matt Mace added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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Quote from Nicholas Sestito's post:
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"Campbell gets the Escape, it walks I to another single which Marinelli secures and out. Marinelli flattens Campbell out and rides him to the end. 4-1 victory for Marinelli."
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I haven't seen it on TV yet and only saw from my seats but it appeared to me that there was some discussion about TeShan going down to start the 3rd. From my perspective, it looked like he did not want to go down. He got up and out pretty quick to preserve his riding point but got taken down shortly after and lost it anyway. Did anyone else feel this way? I thought it was a ballsy call by the staff that ended up paying off even if it was irrelevant in the end.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa v Ohio State
Mike Taylor added to this discussion on January 22, 2018
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Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:
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"Mike...first off, you’ve got to throw Gilman in with that list. Second, I’d take your “copying Dad†theory one step further. I have always seen The Brands brothers as doing their best Dan Gable impression. Granted, a lot was lost in translation, but they tried to emulate The Master. These kids are a copy of a copy. They look like idiots trying to be something they’re not.
Since Spencer Lee signed at Iowa I’ve wondered if he’ll drag the program away from another generation this crap or toward his quiet confidence and stellar technique...and the winning that goes with it. We shall see."
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Gilman is in a class all by himself. I really don't think the Brands care what people think of them. They didn't in college when they competed and they don't now as coaches. Gilman tries to emulate that level of confidence but everything he does screams of desperation for attention and adoration. No matter what he says, he wants to be loved by all. If it didn't matter to him he wouldn't go out of his way to talk about it so much. He's got a little man complex and I'm hoping NaTo (or anyone for that matter) knocks him from the world team and out of public view.
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