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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Justin Hayes added to this discussion on January 23, 2018

This is definitely a reoccurring topic that we should work through:

Do you believe that tOSU has an overall deficiency from the bottom position?

Do you believe that historically tOSU has been deficient in the bottom position?

If so, why?

Or is tOSU doing fine from the bottom position?

What would you change, if anything?



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Freddy Carr added to this discussion on January 23, 2018

No idea on the "why", but I do personally believe it has been an ongoing issue.



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 24, 2018

Complicated question.

Generally speaking, the Bucks get out on bottom. But Iowa's strategy was to slow us down with tactics that would keep the Bucks from scoring. They were successful with them both on the feet and the mat.

Depends on perspective.



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Ryan Dickson added to this discussion on January 24, 2018

I believe the overall problem is the rules of collegiante style mat wrestling. This isn't only a tOSU problem it is a overall issue in college. Competitors getting clasped and follow drilled by a top man while not looking for nearfall is the problem. A rule change that I think needs put in place would be as follows.. if there is a stop in the action ie..out of bounds Potentially dangerous stalemate etc..the top wrestler should have the opportunity to let his opponent off the bottom without giving up the 1pt escape..and also the only way to earn a RT point is to accumulate over 1 minute of riding time but also gaining nearfall at some point while on top. This would force the top man to be more active from the top position or bring the guys back to there feet to increase scoring opportunities. If action is occuring and the top guy releases the bottom man still earns and escape that way there is no grey area but if action stops and he chooses to go back to the feet no pts are awarded.



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on January 24, 2018

To piggy back on Ryan's post - I have a question, why is it if you back of the mat it's stalling, but if, from the top position, you pick an guy up and take him off the mat it's not. Always weird to me.



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 24, 2018

Quote from Ryan Dickson's post:

"I believe the overall problem is the rules of collegiante style mat wrestling. This isn't only a tOSU problem it is a overall issue in college. Competitors getting clasped and follow drilled by a top man while not looking for nearfall is the problem. A rule change that I think needs put in place would be as follows.. if there is a stop in the action ie..out of bounds Potentially dangerous stalemate etc..the top wrestler should have the opportunity to let his opponent off the bottom without giving up the 1pt escape..and also the only way to earn a RT point is to accumulate over 1 minute of riding time but also gaining nearfall at some point while on top. This would force the top man to be more active from the top position or bring the guys back to there feet to increase scoring opportunities. If action is occuring and the top guy releases the bottom man still earns and escape that way there is no grey area but if action stops and he chooses to go back to the feet no pts are awarded."



Love these suggestions.



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Jack Muni added to this discussion on January 24, 2018

Talking about rules, what's up with Myles having his shoe pulled off, the Iowa kid throws it off the mat (no delay penalty), Myles get put on injury time, hustles to get his shoe back on and according to the rules, the Iowa kid chooses the down position and gets an escape point. I just can't figure out how losing your shoe is considered an "injury"???



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on January 24, 2018

Jack - If a shoe comes off and it’s not taped I was I’ve been told that means it hasn’t been properly secured therefore, inj time starts. Granted I think if Miles’s shoe doesn’t come off I don’t think he gets the reversal so he gets two, gives up one. good trade in my book.



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on January 24, 2018

Quote from Ryan Dickson's post:

"I believe the overall problem is the rules of collegiante style mat wrestling. This isn't only a tOSU problem it is a overall issue in college. Competitors getting clasped and follow drilled by a top man while not looking for nearfall is the problem. A rule change that I think needs put in place would be as follows.. if there is a stop in the action ie..out of bounds Potentially dangerous stalemate etc..the top wrestler should have the opportunity to let his opponent off the bottom without giving up the 1pt escape..and also the only way to earn a RT point is to accumulate over 1 minute of riding time but also gaining nearfall at some point while on top. This would force the top man to be more active from the top position or bring the guys back to there feet to increase scoring opportunities. If action is occuring and the top guy releases the bottom man still earns and escape that way there is no grey area but if action stops and he chooses to go back to the feet no pts are awarded."



I'm not sure who you are but I'm going to find my original posts dating back five years, copy and paste or provide a link, and expose this plagiarism!!!!!!! BANK ON IT! :)



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Steve Lester added to this discussion on January 24, 2018

I still think an out of bounds call should be an automatic escape, IF the rideout began with both wrestlers fully inbounds. And yes that would include a wrestler crawling out of bounds from the bottom position. If the top wrestler has full control and is working on a turn, the bottom guy is not crawling out of bounds.
Additionally if a count begins for grabbing the ankle, it should be cumulative. Grab an ankle, let go when referee counts gets to three, grab ankle again, and the referee count should BEGIN AT FOUR the second time. Of course referee count would begin at one again with a stalling call (or with an intervening neutral position achieved).



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Ryan Dickson added to this discussion on January 26, 2018

Quote from Mark Niemann's post:

"

Quote from Ryan Dickson's post:

"I believe the overall problem is the rules of collegiante style mat wrestling. This isn't only a tOSU problem it is a overall issue in college. Competitors getting clasped and follow drilled by a top man while not looking for nearfall is the problem. A rule change that I think needs put in place would be as follows.. if there is a stop in the action ie..out of bounds Potentially dangerous stalemate etc..the top wrestler should have the opportunity to let his opponent off the bottom without giving up the 1pt escape..and also the only way to earn a RT point is to accumulate over 1 minute of riding time but also gaining nearfall at some point while on top. This would force the top man to be more active from the top position or bring the guys back to there feet to increase scoring opportunities. If action is occuring and the top guy releases the bottom man still earns and escape that way there is no grey area but if action stops and he chooses to go back to the feet no pts are awarded."



I'm not sure who you are but I'm going to find my original posts dating back five years, copy and paste or provide a link, and expose this plagiarism!!!!!!! BANK ON IT! :)"


Totally caught me.....and I too don't know you, so the search was difficult...lol...apparently great minds think alike!



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
James Kessen added to this discussion on January 26, 2018

Quote from Ryan Dickson's post:

"

Quote from Mark Niemann's post:

"

Quote from Ryan Dickson's post:

"I believe the overall problem is the rules of collegiante style mat wrestling. This isn't only a tOSU problem it is a overall issue in college. Competitors getting clasped and follow drilled by a top man while not looking for nearfall is the problem. A rule change that I think needs put in place would be as follows.. if there is a stop in the action ie..out of bounds Potentially dangerous stalemate etc..the top wrestler should have the opportunity to let his opponent off the bottom without giving up the 1pt escape..and also the only way to earn a RT point is to accumulate over 1 minute of riding time but also gaining nearfall at some point while on top. This would force the top man to be more active from the top position or bring the guys back to there feet to increase scoring opportunities. If action is occuring and the top guy releases the bottom man still earns and escape that way there is no grey area but if action stops and he chooses to go back to the feet no pts are awarded."




I'm not sure who you are but I'm going to find my original posts dating back five years, copy and paste or provide a link, and expose this plagiarism!!!!!!! BANK ON IT! :)"


Totally caught me.....and I too don't know you, so the search was difficult...lol...apparently great minds think alike!"




Ryan did you wrestle for Indian Lake?



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Josh Lowe added to this discussion on January 27, 2018

Ohio State's issues in top/bottom have been going on for as long as I can remember following them, which goes back to when I was in college (over 15 years).

In many cases, Ohio State wrestlers don't do a good enough job getting crisp breakdowns from the first move of a sequence. There seems to be a willingness to do a token 5-10 second "ride" and then just not give up but almost give up the escape.

On the other hand from bottom, it seems like a lack of explosiveness off the whistle to get the escape off the bat, which enables the top wrestler to get a rhythm going in the ride out.

I think complaining about systemic aspects of college wrestling might be an attempt to mask this issue that Ohio State has too often from the bottom position.

At least that's what I'm seeing.



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Kevin Mount added to this discussion on January 27, 2018

This has REALLY, bothered me about the Buckeyes as well. I guess what is most irritating is that once the issue is realized there is rarely any improvement. I say rarely because I remember Logan after wrestling JO the first time really going to work on his bottom game so the issue would not repeat itself, one of the many admirable things about him.

Also, am in agreement that a parallel ride is stalling. An attempt to turn as well as coming out to the side should be mandatory. Putting a saddle on a guy and just hanging on defeats the purpose of the riding time point for me. Unless your trying to contort, bend, twist, and turn (Stieber/Retherford), your stalling.

Question unrelated to this thread that I may have missed at some point. Any info. on Jose Rodriguez? Has he decided to continue wrestling?



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Discussion Topic: tOSU: Bottom Position
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on January 27, 2018

Ryan - you’re going to fit in well around these parts. Glad to have you aboard.



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