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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Luke Moore added to this discussion on February 10, 2019
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OU is quietly putting together a solid season. I know this is mainly an OSU forum, but the Bobcats have been wrestling well. They have wins over CMU, NIU, Buffalos and KSU in the league and lost a criteria tie breaker to ODU on Friday night.
They currently have 5 guys in the RPI, soon to add a sixth with Guillen having the qualifying matches.
Kelly and Carson are both ranked and Kelly had a big win on Friday night (both guys placed at the Scuffle).
Guillen and Laney have had some real solid performances lately, and Yinger is going to fun to watch over the next 4 years.
I am excited to see how they finish the season.
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on February 11, 2019
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Completely agree Luke. But future success of OU Bobcats will rely on them landing one or two "ready to go" recruits, then landing some studs in the rough (Phil Wellington type guys) and developing them during their redshirt years.
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Ethan Moore added to this discussion on February 11, 2019
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25-65 this year they are good, for sure. All should qualify for NCAAs.
They need to peak at MACs/NCAAs, I feel like this hasn't happened the last few years.
They also need to keep their starters in the line up. Example - Guillen is excellent, but has missed several competitions.
174-197 has been a nightmare this year. It's a testament to the lower weights that they have a winning record.
Someone can fact check me on this, but I don't think they've won a dual meet match at 74 all year. Is that a record?
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Ethan Moore added to this discussion on February 11, 2019
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I like their class for 2019.
I think the gem of the class is Carson Brewer from Avon, Indiana. Currently an 82, can he wrestle 84 or 97 as a freshman next season? He's well credentialed.
Slivka is an Indiana state champ (single class state), but reviewing his results he doesn't score a lot. Probably means he's good on the mat, but you need to score on your feet in college.
McCrone and Sanchez are both solid Ohio recruits, if not spectacular. They both seem to love to compete, judging by the off season, which is plus if I were a college recruiter.
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on February 11, 2019
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Quote from Ethan Moore's post:
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"25-65 this year they are good, for sure. All should qualify for NCAAs.
They need to peak at MACs/NCAAs, I feel like this hasn't happened the last few years.
They also need to keep their starters in the line up. Example - Guillen is excellent, but has missed several competitions.
174-197 has been a nightmare this year. It's a testament to the lower weights that they have a winning record.
Someone can fact check me on this, but I don't think they've won a dual meet match at 74 all year. Is that a record?"
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Losing Austin was a MAJOR blow for them at the end of last year and this year.
Depth is an issue for many colleges -- a huge issue at the smaller DI's.
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on February 11, 2019
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Quote from Ethan Moore's post:
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"They both seem to love to compete, judging by the off season, which is plus if I were a college recruiter."
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Huge +
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Ethan Moore added to this discussion on February 11, 2019
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Scott Nicola added to this discussion on February 11, 2019
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I went to OU from 1994-98 and that seemed to be a golden era for Bobcat wrestling. Those teams had great lightweights lineup that went 118-Shinkle/Noble 126-Enright 134-Kimble. They also had some really tough middle weights like Joey Calhoun and of course Dwight Gardner towards the end of that run. I think their highest NCAA finish was 9th. Maybe this current version of the Bobcats can make a return to glory in similar fashion with homegrown lightweight studs. I also think help is on the way in the upperweights. Including the aforementioned incoming recruits I think Jordan Ernest has a chance to be a very good college heavyweight. Go Cats!
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Christopher Henderson added to this discussion on February 17, 2019
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Good 7-2 win by Cam Kelly today over #8 Brian Lantry of Buffalo. Maybe biggest win of his career?
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on February 17, 2019
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Quote from Christopher Henderson's post:
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"Good 7-2 win by Cam Kelly today over #8 Brian Lantry of Buffalo. Maybe biggest win of his career?"
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Saw that. Nice win for sure.
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Ethan Moore added to this discussion on February 17, 2019
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OU loses a dual today they should win.
Backup 25.
Laney wrestling 33.
No Carson.
No Yinger.
Perhaps a bright spot late in the season is two straight dual wins at 74 from true frosh Logan Stanley.
Kelly has been great for OU for four years, I thought he faded each of the last two seasons late. Perhaps the cut to 33 was massive. Seems healthy and happy at 41.
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Jared Ball added to this discussion on February 18, 2019
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Help me understand why the three other D1 programs in Ohio aren’t more competitive. Pennsylvania high school wrestling is better then Ohio wrestling but the state manages to provide enough in state talent to fuel several highly competitive programs outside of PSU: Lehigh, Pitt, Lock Haven, Edinborough (historically), and others. I know this is a bold statement but I’m almost convinced D2 Notre Dame is the second best program in Ohio behind the Buckeyes. I’m genuinely curious. Is it a lack of administrative support? Resources? I look up and down Kent State, Cleveland State, and OUs line ups and I hardly see any Ohio champs in the lineup. Go look at Notre Dames roster. I know there is some real ignorance on my part here, but I’d really like to know.
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Bob Preusse added to this discussion on February 18, 2019
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Quote from Jared Ball's post:
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"Help me understand why the three other D1 programs in Ohio aren’t more competitive. Pennsylvania high school wrestling is better then Ohio wrestling but the state manages to provide enough in state talent to fuel several highly competitive programs outside of PSU: Lehigh, Pitt, Lock Haven, Edinborough (historically), and others. I know this is a bold statement but I’m almost convinced D2 Notre Dame is the second best program in Ohio behind the Buckeyes. "
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Jared, this is an excellent observation and worthy of debate, imo. Agreed all points but one.
U say "Pennsylvania high school wrestling is better then Ohio wrestling but the state manages to provide enough in state talent to fuel several highly competitive programs outside of PSU: Lehigh, Pitt, Lock Haven, Edinborough (historically), and others." ...historically Clarion too. And look at the PA studs doting NC St, Okla St, Iowa, AZ st, Neb lineups
imo PA high school wrestling is NOT better than Ohio, in fact in the last 15-20 years the case can be made for ILLINOIS as the best high school state. Illinois has dominated national competition in Olympic styles and Ohio has matched PA. NJ is strong and those appear to be the top 4 with NJ 4th. ....
so why has PA the most success in college? usually the most NCAA AAs and always by far the most NCAA quals?.. STYLE, imo, the most emphasis and ability in top/bottom wrestling. Since that is not important in the Olympic styles, PA doesnt dominate the OLympic styles. ...
And of course have to consider the need to replace some coaching staffs as was done at CSU --and 10 years ago Ohio St --could be a factor ....those are my observations, debate it.
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Leo Zimmer added to this discussion on February 18, 2019
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Jared, I'm glad you brought up the question, in fact; it's probably worthy of it's own thread.
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Discussion Topic: Ohio U.
Dan Strope added to this discussion on February 19, 2019
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Quote from Bob Preusse's post:
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"
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Quote from Jared Ball's post:
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"Help me understand why the three other D1 programs in Ohio aren’t more competitive. Pennsylvania high school wrestling is better then Ohio wrestling but the state manages to provide enough in state talent to fuel several highly competitive programs outside of PSU: Lehigh, Pitt, Lock Haven, Edinborough (historically), and others. I know this is a bold statement but I’m almost convinced D2 Notre Dame is the second best program in Ohio behind the Buckeyes. "
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Jared, this is an excellent observation and worthy of debate, imo. Agreed all points but one.
U say "Pennsylvania high school wrestling is better then Ohio wrestling but the state manages to provide enough in state talent to fuel several highly competitive programs outside of PSU: Lehigh, Pitt, Lock Haven, Edinborough (historically), and others." ...historically Clarion too. And look at the PA studs doting NC St, Okla St, Iowa, AZ st, Neb lineups
imo PA high school wrestling is NOT better than Ohio, in fact in the last 15-20 years the case can be made for ILLINOIS as the best high school state. Illinois has dominated national competition in Olympic styles and Ohio has matched PA. NJ is strong and those appear to be the top 4 with NJ 4th. ....
so why has PA the most success in college? usually the most NCAA AAs and always by far the most NCAA quals?.. STYLE, imo, the most emphasis and ability in top/bottom wrestling. Since that is not important in the Olympic styles, PA doesnt dominate the OLympic styles. ...
And of course have to consider the need to replace some coaching staffs as was done at CSU --and 10 years ago Ohio St --could be a factor ....those are my observations, debate it."
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Interesting point of view but not really sure is proof that PA has lost its dominance. Pa has never really embraced the olympic styles as much as folkstyle. Their best kids seem to prefer The Super 32 and folkstyle over Fargo and its Olympic styles. You are correct Illinois has dominated Fargo and the Cadet and Junior duals on multiple levels but PA shines in Greensboro. Of course, this is a general observation as individuals do have their own preferences.
Here is another thought on why PA is successful at the next level. Have you ever watched the Ironman and the Powerade tournaments back to back? At times it looks like two different sports.
Two noticeable differences stand out to me- officiating and the corner coaching.
Ohio officials seem to be much more involved in how the match is wrestled through their interpretations and timing
of stalling calls. PA officials tend to "swallow their whistles" and let the wrestlers dictate the scoring, particularly on the mat. I believe it has also transcended over into and hurt in the coaching ranks. In tight high level matches Ohio "corners" seem to be more focused on working the officials for the stalling call (and often getting it) than coaching their wrestlers into their best scoring positions or through the match. You can hear and see it at any event. On the other hand, PA coaches seem to focus on coaching their kids through a position and creating scoring opportunities instead of "posturing for the call" because they don't expect it to come. The PA environment seems to mimic the NCAA style (excluding Iowa and their embarrassing constant begging). It just makes sense that the PA kids seem better prepared for the NCAA style.
As a side note, one other difference that stands out is the amount of times coaches go to the table. Ohio coaches seems go to the table much much more than their PA counterparts. Not sure why. I know and understand the coach misconduct rule and application and to my knowledge it is the same in both states. Maybe it is just more strictly enforced in PA so again their coaches know and expect that. Just a weird observation.
If you need further proof, watch the wrestling boards in each state as this postseason heats up and notate how many in Ohio will bring up the stall, no stall call and working the edge argument versus the PA boards where it will usually center around topics like "was that control", "it should have been two", "why did he chose down", "who would win the AAA or AA champ'? Seems to be an entirely different culture and expectation on how a match should be officiated and what you are expected to do to score......Just a wrestling fan's opinion.....fire away
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