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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Christopher Henderson added to this discussion on November 12, 2022
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Excellent point, Jeff! Losing is not good for the team. Any team.
Also, if I were Sammy, I would feel a little bit slighted to be asked to go to a lower weight class for the sake of a freshman.
Also, along the weight cutting topic, Kharchla wrestled 170lbs five years ago. He hasn't had the same pop the last couple years as the weight cut keeps getting worse. But, honestly, that might be because of the knee injury a while back. He's never looked the same after that.
Looking forward to see what Hepner can do next year, though.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Alex Creech added to this discussion on November 12, 2022
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Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:
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"I just don’t understand…if 157 is his best weight then why not go 157? What’s the upside for the lineup as it is now? Clearly I’m not in the room or in the know, but from the outside looking in 149, 157 and 165 all would be better wrestlers up a weight. Why not move up and challenge. I think Smith and Kharchla would be a great bout. Who knows how good Klarchla would be at a more natural weight? And if he can’t beat Smith, then he sits a year. It’s. It the end of the world that someone might be a backup to an All American for one season.
I would understand if tOSU was in the hunt for an NCAA title, if those points had the potential to put them over the top. But that’s not the case. You’re talking about the difference between seventh and fourth. So what?get everyone healthy and strong and prepare to make a run in a year or two with the fantastic underclassmen you’ve got on the roster.
Am I missing something?"
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Yes, you are. You don't bench a 5th year senior all american with an underclassman unless that guy is kyle dake, logan stieber, etc.... and is nearly a lock to win a title. So Ethan and Kaleb aren't going anywhere.
Paddy likely isn't beating Carson, so if Carson wants to sit a year so he can go 174, I suppose that's up to him, but I'm guessing he wants to wrestle.
Same with Paddy, if he really doesn't want to cut he could just sit or transfer, but again, I'm guessing he'd rather wrestle.
So really it comes down to Sammy going 157 and paddy sitting. This is all based on some assumption that 157 is Sammy's ideal weight. I'm not really sure how anyone knows that. If it was his ideal weight, why didn't he go 157 last year or the year before when there really wasn't anyone AA caliber manning the weight.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Jeff Fortman added to this discussion on November 12, 2022
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I hate to even think it, but it's always a possibility, maybe he has just regressed. Who knows how his body is after years of wrestling. Maybe he is a different sasso than we saw 2 years ago. He's still excellent and it's early on, weight may not be the major issue here...
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Don Bork added to this discussion on November 12, 2022
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Lots of speculation about several guys wrestling at the wrong weight. Just one week after talk of an excellent weekend at the MSU Open. Fans that are not in the room for training or meetings pretty sure they know better than the staff? No, the Buckeyes didn’t perform as was hoped in this duel and I expect our coaches and athletes are as disappointed as most of us are. But it’s one duel, lots of season left to wrestle. I’ll trust the staff over those who think they know.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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Why didn’t he go 157 last year is the same reason he isn’t going this year. There were zero capable guys at 149 other than sasso. There were two capable guys at 157 last year. Hepner was close to being a qualifier….they were also waiting to see if paddy could go. Once his open results were unsatisfactorily that made the decision. Ohio state wanted to keep the door open in case he was the recruit everyone thought he was. If he showed Myles Martin results he would have wrestled. 157 is Sammy’s ideal weight. He can recover In a tourney setting much better than a dual but teams are targeting him as an early match at this point in a dual. I mean did you watch him barely get to the center circle at the end of the third. He took absolutely as much time as a ref would allow imo. He was already beat at that point. I can’t even believe people keep wanting to say or argue he is better off at 149. Tom has stated it. He wrestles 70 kg, and he literally couldn’t walk to the center circle as the match ended. Virginia tech even knows it. Tom has absolutely turned this program around but he makes too many questionable decesions. Great man, great mentor,great recruiter. Even penn state calls him the recruiting champ and laugh about it because they don’t develop the same way. Anyway we will know better at cklv a better understanding on this team. If paddy struggles there then I make the move.
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Quote from Alex Creech's post:
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"
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Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:
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"I just don’t understand…if 157 is his best weight then why not go 157? What’s the upside for the lineup as it is now? Clearly I’m not in the room or in the know, but from the outside looking in 149, 157 and 165 all would be better wrestlers up a weight. Why not move up and challenge. I think Smith and Kharchla would be a great bout. Who knows how good Klarchla would be at a more natural weight? And if he can’t beat Smith, then he sits a year. It’s. It the end of the world that someone might be a backup to an All American for one season.
I would understand if tOSU was in the hunt for an NCAA title, if those points had the potential to put them over the top. But that’s not the case. You’re talking about the difference between seventh and fourth. So what?get everyone healthy and strong and prepare to make a run in a year or two with the fantastic underclassmen you’ve got on the roster.
Am I missing something?"
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Yes, you are. You don't bench a 5th year senior all american with an underclassman unless that guy is kyle dake, logan stieber, etc.... and is nearly a lock to win a title. So Ethan and Kaleb aren't going anywhere.
Paddy likely isn't beating Carson, so if Carson wants to sit a year so he can go 174, I suppose that's up to him, but I'm guessing he wants to wrestle.
Same with Paddy, if he really doesn't want to cut he could just sit or transfer, but again, I'm guessing he'd rather wrestle.
So really it comes down to Sammy going 157 and paddy sitting. This is all based on some assumption that 157 is Sammy's ideal weight. I'm not really sure how anyone knows that. If it was his ideal weight, why didn't he go 157 last year or the year before when there really wasn't anyone AA caliber manning the weight."
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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As someone who has overreacted to dual losses in the past, I'm resisting the urge to do so now.
But I am convinced that Mike Rodriguez is on the mark. In addition, I know that someone with intimate knowledge of the situation feels Kharchla is hampered badly by his cut.
Bucks have options. You can move Decatur up to 149. While he's not large, my guess is he could be your Jason Johnstone for a season. He's also a senior and would probably love a chance to compete regularly even at this weight.
As far as Smith vs Kharchla goes, you can switch them off. I think Nick Lecklider argues persuasively but I remember PSU having a situation at 197 several years ago with Rasheed and Cassar. They also had two standouts last season with Beard and Dean.
Tom Ryan continuously asks wrestlers to sacrifice and the same problems occur. I'd rather just get guys at the best weights and see how they do.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Mike Stann added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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Two things. First we have this discussion almost every year about a poor performance early in the year. All I have to add is that nearly every year tOSU wrestling maxes out at the NCAAs.
Second the weight cutting discussion continues. It seems to me from following the team for some time now that Tom believes that regardless of the squad's outlook he puts the best team on the mat. He seems to put that as a top priority as opposed to redshirting and planning out future squads. This is what has led to some, imo, brutal weight cutting. Nick Heflin and NateT come to mind. As I have watched over the years it seems most young men benefit from wrestling their natural weight instead of cutting massive weight. Again Nick Heflin is the poster child for that.
I did run across an article about Frank Molinaro and the new coach at Penn St (at the time) and how much fun wrestling was under a new weight management program. It seems the whole team makes weight the night before a meet and then goes to Subway. I know Bo Nikal talked about how much fun the squad had under Cael. I wonder if how they manage weight is part of that. It seems that they have wrestlers progress up in weight throughout their career. The down side to this approach is many years you will have holes in your lineup.
All I have to add is that if a wrestler is too tired to hardly be able to stand at the start of overtime then one of three things are true. One, the some wrestlers simply haven't the gas tank. Kenny Courts comes to mind. Two, they are not cutting (managing) weight properly. Three they are wrestling at a weight far below their natural weight.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
John Joyce added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:
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"I just don’t understand…if 157 is his best weight then why not go 157? What’s the upside for the lineup as it is now? Clearly I’m not in the room or in the know, but from the outside looking in 149, 157 and 165 all would be better wrestlers up a weight. Why not move up and challenge. I think Smith and Kharchla would be a great bout. Who knows how good Klarchla would be at a more natural weight? And if he can’t beat Smith, then he sits a year. It’s. It the end of the world that someone might be a backup to an All American for one season.
I would understand if tOSU was in the hunt for an NCAA title, if those points had the potential to put them over the top. But that’s not the case. You’re talking about the difference between seventh and fourth. So what?get everyone healthy and strong and prepare to make a run in a year or two with the fantastic underclassmen you’ve got on the roster.
Am I missing something?"
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The difference between 7th and 4th is a team trophy.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Alex Creech added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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Quote from Nick Lecklider's post:
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"Why didn’t he go 157 last year is the same reason he isn’t going this year. There were zero capable guys at 149 other than sasso. There were two capable guys at 157 last year. Hepner was close to being a qualifier….they were also waiting to see if paddy could go. Once his open results were unsatisfactorily that made the decision. Ohio state wanted to keep the door open in case he was the recruit everyone thought he was. If he showed Myles Martin results he would have wrestled. "
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Where are you getting your information?
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Alex Creech added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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As far as Smith vs Kharchla goes, you can switch them off.
Tom Ryan continuously asks wrestlers to sacrifice and the same problems occur. I'd rather just get guys at the best weights and see how they do."
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I don't know what Tom's philosophy is, but I wouldn't tell a last year all american who's sacrificed and poured everything he had into the program, that he has to sit because an underclassman "might" be slightly better (and that's a big if).
How do you know Tom is asking the wrestlers to sacrifice? Being unselfish and part of a team is a huge factor. Maybe these guys just want to get in the lineup anyway they can.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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Alex: Good point. I don't know anything for certain.
I am not in favor of asking anyone to sit. But tOSU would not be the first program to have two AA's competing for one spot. It's happened plenty. May the best man win if that's the case.
I will say that I think the staff discusses how they'd like the lineup to play out with the wrestlers.
Mike Stann also points out that the Bucks usually wrestle their best at the end of the season. But he also talks about Nick Heflin as a specific example of a guy making a huge cut who performed better when he moved up.
J.D. Bergman was also a multiple AA at 197 who had his finest season up at 285.
Lots of perspectives here and all are valid.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Don Bork added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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First, I have to believe that Coach Ryan will do what he believes is in the best interest of the team this season and the program in general. We have in past seasons on occasion underperformed early, but have bounced back to have successful post seasons.
I’m also certain that there are discussions between coaches and wrestlers at the end of each season in planning for the next season that includes who is returning, possible lineups, and potential changes in weight class. I don’t expect Ryan forces anyone to remain at a specific weight, though I see him as a good salesman. That salesmanship may have come in handy in convincing Smith and Romero to return this year. I have also considered that Decatur could bump up to 149 if Sasso were to move up. I will say that I am not in the camp of those who would anoint Sasso as the certain champ at 157, too many good wrestlers. Austin O’Connor is currently ranked 7th.
So, if it is true that Karchla is making a difficult cut as Hank says, then my assumption is that he and Paddy both move up, making 174 a wrestle off between Karchla and Smith. Neither has a redshirt available so they would share the weight with Ryan then having to decide who would represent TOSU in the tournaments. Best wrestler goes, which might be a real kick in the pants to Smith if he was “talked into” returning this season.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Alex Creech added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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"Alex: Good point. I don't know anything for certain.
I am not in favor of asking anyone to sit. But tOSU would not be the first program to have two AA's competing for one spot. It's happened plenty. May the best man win if that's the case.
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I agree, unless one of those guys is final year guy and has been with the program the whole time. But that's just what I would do, but I would understand if that's what Tom does.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Don Bork added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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If Karchla was clearly the better wrestler over the next three months you can’t tell him that you’re choosing Smith because he’s in his sixth year here and you’re only in your fourth year. Better man has to wrestle unless you want to lose credibility within your whole program.
Another, perhaps less important consideration, might we have one less wrestler become an AA? I feel like Paddy at 157 has a far better shot than Decatur at149 if we bump.
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Discussion Topic: Va. Tech v. TOSU
Alex Creech added to this discussion on November 13, 2022
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Quote from Don Bork's post:
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"If Karchla was clearly the better wrestler over the next three months you can’t tell him that you’re choosing Smith because he’s in his sixth year here and you’re only in your fourth year. Better man has to wrestle unless you want to lose credibility within your whole program."
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This is Carson's 3rd year. He's clearly not better or Smith probably wouldn't have come back. Fighting for a team trophy and winning duals is a huge deal for the program and the wrestlers. Carson is not moving up this year.
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