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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Ethan Moore added to this discussion on January 8, 2022
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Fellas, I’m gonna die on this hill.
These 24 and 25 year olds wrestling in college - they’re bodies are tired. 6 years in a college room isn’t healthy. Bull, Desanto, Eierman all looked fatigued.
I know this is not popular but I like Iowa. I like Tom and Terry.
But I hammer TTUN for their AARP wrestling team so I gotta lay into the Hawks as well.
They need rest for the stretch run.
Loved seeing Ayala. I’m excited about him.
Steveson is an all-timer.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on January 8, 2022
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I was watching Alex Marinelli and for the first time (I’ve witnessed in his career) he went out of bounds and was on a knee looking to his corner. I’ve always seen him stand up and hurry back to the center.
So, I agree with you, Ethan. If nothing else, The Bill looked tired last night.
ps: Drake Ayala is proof that even though you might not win the match, you can put on a performance of fight and grit that will win over a crowd*.
*crowd equals me this time.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 8, 2022
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Good observations by both of you. My feeling after watching Iowa last night was that they have no chance to beat out PSU. When I saw Kemmerer wearing that shoulder brace--an obvious indicator that his shoulder isn't stable due to subluxation--I felt sorry for him. He came back for one more shot at an NCAA title and I doubt he has a remote chance to win.
Ethan you mention fatigue. How about Labriola and Venz from Nebraska both getting upset at home vs Purdue opponents?
I have rarely thought about the folkstyle grind and how it wears guys down. Now it's going to be central in my mind as I watch young no-names from Purdue and Minny give tough battles to guys who used to seem near invincible.
Aside--Gable Steveson might be the best college wrestler I've ever seen. He could have beaten Cassiopi by 25 if he'd needed to do it. If I had a time machine, I'd put him on the mat against Mocco. That's the only guy I can think of who might have been able to slow him down.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Jared Ball added to this discussion on January 8, 2022
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All fair points, and probably spot on. I’ll give a counter perspective. I’m the flo film Terry there was point where Gable approached Terry and encouraged him to train different. Flabbergasted and without a clue, Terry only knew one way of training…grinding day in and day out. That goes completely counter to the human body’s ability to recuperate. There has been a big shift in collegiate and senior level wrestling in recent years to focus more on recovery. I think you’re all correct, they are old and tired. But they aren’t training for a dual against Minnesota in January. They’ll be ready come March. I will say that this is remarkably different than Iowa in recent years. I’ve always noticed, unlike most teams, the Hawks always seemed to compete at a high level throughout the season. Whereas other programs tended to hit peeks and valleys. The down side of that is that the opportunity for growth appeared to be less than other programs. I guess we’ll see
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 8, 2022
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Jared--worth considering. But I've never seen Iowa look so flat for a home dual.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on January 9, 2022
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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"...
Aside--Gable Steveson might be the best college wrestler I've ever seen. He could have beaten Cassiopi by 25 if he'd needed to do it. If I had a time machine, I'd put him on the mat against Mocco. That's the only guy I can think of who might have been able to slow him down."
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Ahem!?
Just saying.
;-)
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on January 9, 2022
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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"Aside--Gable Steveson might be the best college wrestler I've ever seen. He could have beaten Cassiopi by 25 if he'd needed to do it. If I had a time machine, I'd put him on the mat against Mocco. That's the only guy I can think of who might have been able to slow him down."
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With how Cole Knorad dominated Mocco that final year, I don't see Mocco ever beating this version of Steveson. The freshman version of him he had a chance of beating.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Jim Kessen added to this discussion on January 9, 2022
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Eierman barely beats kids from Purdue who he pinned 2x last year.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Jeff Streu added to this discussion on January 10, 2022
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In Iowa's defense (how often do I say that?), Kemerer just teched the Purdue guy that upset Labriola and Assad just beat the Purdue guy that upset Venz. Marinelli, Young, and Murin got bonus, but I'm not familiar with the opponents they beat. Cassioppi got a fall against a decent, but unranked, opponent. Ayala just beat Shroder 6-1, so he may not be as big a drop off in points from Spencer as we thought.
Team race will be interesting for sure.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Brian Mathews added to this discussion on January 10, 2022
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Great points all around.
But, with all due respect to Steve Mocco, Gable would kill him.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 11, 2022
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Quote from Brian Mathews's post:
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"Great points all around.
But, with all due respect to Steve Mocco, Gable would kill him."
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You may be right. But until his senior year, Mocco was seemingly invincible. Plus his low center of gravity caused trouble for everyone. Konrad, however, was kryptonite for Mocco.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on January 11, 2022
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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"
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Quote from Brian Mathews's post:
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"Great points all around.
But, with all due respect to Steve Mocco, Gable would kill him."
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You may be right. But until his senior year, Mocco was seemingly invincible. Plus his low center of gravity caused trouble for everyone. Konrad, however, was kryptonite for Mocco."
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Mocco has six losses that I can remember. He was legendary in high school, and clearly had a spectacular NCAA career, but I don't think, when it's all said and done, his career will compare favorably to Steveson's.
In my mind he goes down as one of the great heavyweights of all time (top ten?). His bouts with Rowlands were always close, hard fought matches. Rowlands, to me, is another all time great heavyweight. I look at Steveson as a bigger, stronger Rowlands (high praise). He has the quickness, agility and skill of Rowlands paired with the size and strength of Mocco/Konrad.
He also has an Olympic gold medal.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Drew Taylor added to this discussion on January 11, 2022
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Mocco and Steveson are the two most intimidating competitors I've witnessed in my 20 plus years of following college wrestling. Brent Metcalf is third.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on January 11, 2022
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I get that Mocco and Metcalf had an edge and a swagger to them, but their results just don't measure up. While both were incredibly successful, I felt like their "intimidation" points went way down based on their high profile losses and by the way they finished up their careers (both college and international).
Metcalf being dominated by Caldwell in the NCAA finals his junior year is one of those matches no one will ever forget. The next year, the intimidation magic seemed to have worn off with Palmer beating him for the Big Ten title and giving him a competitive bout in the finals. Same with Mocco transferring and then losing to Konrad. They just seemed so "human".
Also, the way they just couldn’t figure out the international game doesn't help.
Just one guys opinion, and I'm wrong a lot.
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Discussion Topic: Iowa looks tired
Mike Stann added to this discussion on January 11, 2022
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I always felt Cole Konrad was the most intimidating heavy I saw. As a senior I remember at the ncaas that folks simply didn't want to get on the mat with him. Now if we are talking greatest (not most intimidating) heavy tOSU did have a guy who won three championships in three tries (and a gold medal but not at heavy).
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