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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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There have been a lot of rumblings on boards about a change needed to be made to the coaching staff. Tom has absolutely turned this program around, but now he can become a victim of his own success. Thad Matta is a perfect example of this. It’s what have you done for me lately. Ohio state is trending downward at this point in the season and not wrestling up to expectations so far. He has brought in a monster recruiting class so in my opinion you need to let him at least see what he does next season. My question is if by that point results again don’t live up to expectations with the best recruiting class maybe ever who would you like to see be the next in line at coach? In my opinion I think you need to go outside the program to get new perspectives in the room.
Here are a list of guys I would go after. It would be 2024 by the end of next season and ending the Olympic Cylcle that summer.
1. David Taylor
2. Jordan Burroughs
3. Ben askren
Just would like a younger guy that can spark this program back into title contention and I could see these guys doing it. Who would your dream coaches be if you could hand pick someone?
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Christopher Henderson added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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I agree. Sometimes, you need new coaches/coaching. That doesn't mean tOSU can't build a couple statues of Tom Ryan for the entrances of the Covelli Gym and Saint John Arena, thanking him for the championship he won.
The direction of the team has been negative for about the last four years. 2019-2nd, 2020-No Tournament, 2021-9th, 2022-11th, 2022/23 8th at Vegas, losing a dual to Northern Iowa.
The recruits have been top notch, but results haven't. Is there a single returning starter who looks better than they did last year?
It's time to stop pretending everything is all right and shake things up a little bit.
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Alex Creech added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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No thank you. Be careful what you wish for.
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Jim Kessen added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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Quote from Christopher Henderson's post:
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"I agree. Sometimes, you need new coaches/coaching. That doesn't mean tOSU can't build a couple statues of Tom Ryan for the entrances of the Covelli Gym and Saint John Arena, thanking him for the championship he won.
The direction of the team has been negative for about the last four years. 2019-2nd, 2020-No Tournament, 2021-9th, 2022-11th, 2022/23 8th at Vegas, losing a dual to Northern Iowa.
The recruits have been top notch, but results haven't. Is there a single returning starter who looks better than they did last year?
It's time to stop pretending everything is all right and shake things up a little bit."
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So basically they’ve had one bad year and took 8th in Vegas when half the team didn’t wrestle or MFF out and they lost to UNI with 2 starters missing.
I’m not saying everything is unicorns and rainbows but not buying into sky is falling.
This thread happens every year . Let’s just see how the season plays out.
Would I like to see them add a young guy outside the program yes.
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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That is two straight bad years and this year so far isn’t looking bright. A lot can change between now and march however. Anything outside top 5 is considered a bad year at Ohio state at this point. With the recruits being brought in it is almost inexcusable. I would personally let him see what he can do with all these redshirt freshman in the lineup next year and evaluate at that point. If it’s two more unsuccessful March I think it’s time for a change. If he has success then you keep letting him build on it. I am very worried about the development of these young men. I think Kyle Snyder knew it also and got out. I am just saying hypothetically if we have a couple more bad years who would you look for to replace Tom Ryan?
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Jim Kessen added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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Quote from Nick Lecklider's post:
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"That is two straight bad years and this year so far isn’t looking bright. A lot can change between now and march however. Anything outside top 5 is considered a bad year at Ohio state at this point. With the recruits being brought in it is almost inexcusable. I would personally let him see what he can do with all these redshirt freshman in the lineup next year and evaluate at that point. If it’s two more unsuccessful March I think it’s time for a change. If he has success then you keep letting him build on it. I am very worried about the development of these young men. I think Kyle Snyder knew it also and got out. I am just saying hypothetically if we have a couple more bad years who would you look for to replace Tom Ryan?"
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Kyle Snyder hasn’t done anything he didn’t do at tOSU. The only time he beat Sadulaev was when he was at ORTC.
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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After beating the Russian he started regressing. Lost to alborov, then pinned by Russian, lost to magonedov, loss to sharifov, then pinned by iranian. He knew he was regressing. He was taking bad losses alll over the place. Since joining penn state he has only lost to Russian. He will never beat the Russian again, he is just better. So I disagree with your assessment. Every other indication shows he has improved pretty significantly since leaving.
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Quote from Jim Kessen's post:
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"
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Quote from Nick Lecklider's post:
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"That is two straight bad years and this year so far isn’t looking bright. A lot can change between now and march however. Anything outside top 5 is considered a bad year at Ohio state at this point. With the recruits being brought in it is almost inexcusable. I would personally let him see what he can do with all these redshirt freshman in the lineup next year and evaluate at that point. If it’s two more unsuccessful March I think it’s time for a change. If he has success then you keep letting him build on it. I am very worried about the development of these young men. I think Kyle Snyder knew it also and got out. I am just saying hypothetically if we have a couple more bad years who would you look for to replace Tom Ryan?"
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Kyle Snyder hasn’t done anything he didn’t do at tOSU. The only time he beat Sadulaev was when he was at ORTC."
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Alex Creech added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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Quote from Christopher Henderson's post:
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"I agree. Sometimes, you need new coaches/coaching. That doesn't mean tOSU can't build a couple statues of Tom Ryan for the entrances of the Covelli Gym and Saint John Arena, thanking him for the championship he won.
The direction of the team has been negative for about the last four years. 2019-2nd, 2020-No Tournament, 2021-9th, 2022-11th, 2022/23 8th at Vegas, losing a dual to Northern Iowa.
The recruits have been top notch, but results haven't. Is there a single returning starter who looks better than they did last year?
It's time to stop pretending everything is all right and shake things up a little bit."
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Uh, i'll give you the last 2 years, but a 2nd in 2019 and a likely top 3 in 2020 is not bad.
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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When you are Tom Ryan and have a staff with Logan Stieber, J. Jaggers and Bo Jordan, there is a large amount of talent in the room. But is that talent working well as a unit?
Sometimes the best staffs are comprised of a few no name guys following the head coaches lead and pulling in the same direction.
When Tom Ryan was the head coach at Hofstra, he did an incredible job coaching kids up on his own.
Now he has three guys to whom he defers. I think it's a problem albeit a solvable one. But there needs to be an overriding philosophy that all four coaches adhere to. All I see is a mess. Terrible riding, bad strategy and the sense that all matches should be won only in neutral. It's not working well and they are squandering talent as a result.
The four staff members need to either figure it out or change needs to take place.
This team is a disappointment when you consider how good it should be. Wrestlers are regressing. And other programs are showing them up. That never used to happen.
I don't have a firm answer here. But it's obvious that something is wrong above and beyond injuries.
There are plenty of smart people on this forum who do a better job than me of articulating the obvious issues.
The should be listened to.
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Jim Kessen added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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Quote from Nick Lecklider's post:
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"After beating the Russian he started regressing. Lost to alborov, then pinned by Russian, lost to magonedov, loss to sharifov, then pinned by iranian. He knew he was regressing. He was taking bad losses alll over the place. Since joining penn state he has only lost to Russian. He will never beat the Russian again, he is just better. So I disagree with your assessment. Every other indication shows he has improved pretty significantly since leaving.
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Quote from Jim Kessen's post:
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"
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Quote from Nick Lecklider's post:
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"That is two straight bad years and this year so far isn’t looking bright. A lot can change between now and march however. Anything outside top 5 is considered a bad year at Ohio state at this point. With the recruits being brought in it is almost inexcusable. I would personally let him see what he can do with all these redshirt freshman in the lineup next year and evaluate at that point. If it’s two more unsuccessful March I think it’s time for a change. If he has success then you keep letting him build on it. I am very worried about the development of these young men. I think Kyle Snyder knew it also and got out. I am just saying hypothetically if we have a couple more bad years who would you look for to replace Tom Ryan?"
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Kyle Snyder hasn’t done anything he didn’t do at tOSU. The only time he beat Sadulaev was when he was at ORTC."
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Good points but I don’t think using Kyle in your state of Buckeye wrestling is a good example since he was a 4x finalist and 3x NC Olympic champ why wrestling for Ohio state.
I think Bucks do pretty good with FR. SO but do agree kids kind of fade. I’m not arguing they shouldn’t make some changes I just don’t think they should make a HC change and also know you aren’t either.
You guys have a good holiday and go Bucks
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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I think one problem is that all these guys all have been trained inside the wrestling room at Ohio state. No outside perspective. Tom just brings on his own guys who wrestled here. If Tom does stay I think he should at least shake the staff up and get a penn state guy, an iowa guy, just some guys outside the program. And a coach for the upper weights also. Let them bring their culture and training methods along with them. Losing rosella and Tervel really hurt them.
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Jack Muni added to this discussion on December 21, 2022
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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"When you are Tom Ryan and have a staff with Logan Stieber, J. Jaggers and Bo Jordan, there is a large amount of talent in the room. But is that talent working well as a unit?
Sometimes the best staffs are comprised of a few no name guys following the head coaches lead and pulling in the same direction.
When Tom Ryan was the head coach at Hofstra, he did an incredible job coaching kids up on his own.
Now he has three guys to whom he defers. I think it's a problem albeit a solvable one. But there needs to be an overriding philosophy that all four coaches adhere to. All I see is a mess. Terrible riding, bad strategy and the sense that all matches should be won only in neutral. It's not working well and they are squandering talent as a result.
The four staff members need to either figure it out or change needs to take place.
This team is a disappointment when you consider how good it should be. Wrestlers are regressing. And other programs are showing them up. That never used to happen.
I don't have a firm answer here. But it's obvious that something is wrong above and beyond injuries.
There are plenty of smart people on this forum who do a better job than me of articulating the obvious issues.
The should be listened to."
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One thing I always found odd was that in most of the NCAA Championship/Semi matches coach Ryan is not in the corner, it's always one or two of the assistant coaches. Seems like Brands and Sanderson are always at mat side especially in the big matches, you would think the head coach would want to be there???
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on December 22, 2022
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Quote from Nick Lecklider's post:
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"...get a penn state guy, an iowa guy, just some guys outside the program. And a coach for the upper weights also. Let them bring their culture and training methods along with them. "
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Tom is an Iowa guy.
Look at Iowa Staff. ISU Staff. OkSt Staff. I'm almost positive they are competed for the same university (not THE same, but all on staff were from same school).
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on December 22, 2022
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Quote from Brady Hiatt's post:
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"
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Quote from Nick Lecklider's post:
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"...get a penn state guy, an iowa guy, just some guys outside the program. And a coach for the upper weights also. Let them bring their culture and training methods along with them. "
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Tom is an Iowa guy.
Look at Iowa Staff. ISU Staff. OkSt Staff. I'm almost positive they are competed for the same university (not THE same, but all on staff were from same school)."
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Brent Metcalf seems to be having a major impact on ISU. He and Dresser are both Iowa guys but different eras.
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Discussion Topic: The future of Ohio state wrestling
Jim Kessen added to this discussion on December 22, 2022
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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"
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Quote from Brady Hiatt's post:
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"
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Quote from Nick Lecklider's post:
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"...get a penn state guy, an iowa guy, just some guys outside the program. And a coach for the upper weights also. Let them bring their culture and training methods along with them. "
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Tom is an Iowa guy.
Look at Iowa Staff. ISU Staff. OkSt Staff. I'm almost positive they are competed for the same university (not THE same, but all on staff were from same school)."
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Brent Metcalf seems to be having a major impact on ISU. He and Dresser are both Iowa guys but different eras."
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Agree ISU is having a break out year but this is the 1st one for Dresser who has been there for 6 years and Metcalf for 5.
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