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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on April 11, 2024
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Tom was interviewed on Flo today about the transfer portal era. Basically just saying he plays by the rules while he believes others don’t. That wasn’t what I really cared to listen to but did hear a couple other things when discussing the team
1. If Sammy decides he is ready to wrestle it wouldn’t be until second semester more than likely. He would at that point enroll in classes if he’s ready to go. So no one may know until December.
2. It sounded like he said Cannon was getting bigger and may challenge for the spot at 149 with demilio. I’m excited for this. That also means mendes more than likely stays at 141.
3. Also said paddy could go one of two weight classes which is 157/165 im guessing. With what is said I can only positively say 141 is mendes and 285 is Feldman. Even Rocco was huge. Every other weight is more than likely up in the air.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Drew Taylor added to this discussion on April 12, 2024
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Pyles also said - and Tom didn’t push back so it’s probably true- that the Bucks went after Cardenas in the portal. He of course picked Michigan.
Glad he was pursued. Bucks won’t beat Michigan for transfers but will win battles for HS talent. Keep in mind Mendez was between Ohio State and Michigan.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Jack Muni added to this discussion on April 12, 2024
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One thing Mich has is a decent OTC program, whereas OSU used to have one. Hope Lou Rosselli can turn things around.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on April 12, 2024
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Quote from Jack Muni's post:
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"One thing Mich has is a decent OTC program, whereas OSU used to have one. Hope Lou Rosselli can turn things around."
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Michigan is having a lot of success as an RTC. They have money and have an Olympic medalist and a World Champ in the last few years. Neither have repped the USA but it's easier to make a team from Mexico, Serbia, Croatia, San Moreno, etc...
As a collegiate program, they've bought their way towards the awards stand but they have also stepped up their recruiting.
UM has Cliff Keen money plus successful alums. They might be the wealthiest program in the country which is saying a lot when you think about PSU, Iowa among others. I have no idea. But it's obvious they've been able to offer a lot in NIL.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Jim Kessen added to this discussion on April 12, 2024
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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"
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Quote from Jack Muni's post:
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"One thing Mich has is a decent OTC program, whereas OSU used to have one. Hope Lou Rosselli can turn things around."
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Michigan is having a lot of success as an RTC. They have money and have an Olympic medalist and a World Champ in the last few years. Neither have repped the USA but it's easier to make a team from Mexico, Serbia, Croatia, San Moreno, etc...
As a collegiate program, they've bought their way towards the awards stand but they have also stepped up their recruiting.
UM has Cliff Keen money plus successful alums. They might be the wealthiest program in the country which is saying a lot when you think about PSU, Iowa among others. I have no idea. But it's obvious they've been able to offer a lot in NIL."
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Have they really stepped up their recruiting? If that was the case would they really need to bring in 3-5 one year rentals a year.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on April 13, 2024
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The last couple recruiting cycles (including the incoming class) appear to be successful.
But prior to that time, they've done a lousy job developing their talent. Hence their need to rent wrestlers.
We can bang on them for not doing a good job in that area but the current rules allow you to buy wrestlers and they're taking advantage.
So are Iowa and PSU. Tom Ryan is in a tough spot in this regard. If you look at the Bucks returning lineup, the difference between a good and great team is getting a few more studs in the lineup.
Would any of us have complained if Hamiti and Cardenas were coming to Columbus?
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Jim Kessen added to this discussion on April 13, 2024
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Nope and I would’ve picked them up from the airport.
I was just playing devils advocate.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on April 13, 2024
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And therein lies the rub…it’s not that tOSU is “above” using NIL and the portal, it’s that they’re not as successful at it as three other Big Ten teams. Thats all Pyles was saying and it seemed that on social media Coach Ryan was saying that was a lie, but in the interview it seems it was the truth. Am I missing something?
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Alex Creech added to this discussion on April 13, 2024
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NCAA guidelines are clear that you are not supposed to use NIL to recruit. NIL is supposed to be something the athlete can seek out once enrolled.
The NCAA would like to enforce these guidelines but it's nearly impossible now with state and federal governments involved.
There are programs that honor these guidelines (tOSU) and there are those that don't.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Jim Kessen added to this discussion on April 13, 2024
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Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:
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"And therein lies the rub…it’s not that tOSU is “above” using NIL and the portal, it’s that they’re not as successful at it as three other Big Ten teams. Thats all Pyles was saying and it seemed that on social media Coach Ryan was saying that was a lie, but in the interview it seems it was the truth. Am I missing something?"
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From I gathered on X Pyles was saying Ohio state was using NIL when referring to McKenna, Tate and others and TR was saying that was before NIL and not the same as going out and buying an AA. Either way not sure it was a good look.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on April 13, 2024
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Kessen: that (McKenna & Orndorff) was one big part of Ryan’s response on X (Twitter).
Additionally, one of Coach Ryan’s points of ire and sticking points was that Pyles’ post - in light of the context of portal & NIL - made it seem like OHST was currently & actively seeking wrestlers who are in the portal. In an effort to clarify that, Coach Ryan cited “trust” “communication” & “relationships” with his current team about any and all dealings with the portal.
Lastly, I think as the communications developed between Ryan & Pyles, and others started chiming in, the discussion veered from the original issue - an example would be someone mentioning that Coach Ryan was a transfer himself. If one cannot see the difference between what occurred when Ryan left Syracuse for Iowa and what is happening now (portal & NIL), then no discussion - on this forum, on social media, or even in person can help.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on April 13, 2024
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But doesn’t the fact that tOSU has tried and failed in the portal negate any virtue signaling with regard to portal athletes? And are we to believe that Penn State, Michigan and Iowa are blatantly cheating in plain sight while Ohio State is the only top tier wrestling team who is following the rules?
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Alex Creech added to this discussion on April 13, 2024
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I think you're missing the point, Michael.
Tom Ryan isn't opposed to transfers, he's opposed to buying transfers, which you are not supposed to do.
I'm sure they've contacted individuals in the portal or have been contacted, but I'm guessing Ryan won't negotiate NIL $.
I have no idea if PSU, Michigan, Iowa or others engage in this, but there have been several coaches mention it does happen, but won't name names.
But when you hear so and so got X to go here, is pretty clear they negotiated the NIL amount before committing. Whether that was through the program or the NIL collective, neither is supposed to happen.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Jared Ball added to this discussion on April 14, 2024
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But I think Michael raises a fair point, it is virtue signaling. It’s raising the question of whether or not Michigan has earned what they have achieved with these move ins. TR has loudly proclaimed, we recruit and develop guys, and although he isn’t saying it, it’s certainly inferred that Michigan is just buying trophies.
It’s like the Yankees. For years that won, and everyone pointed to the 300 million dollar payroll, and 30 million dollar player contracts. They were buying championships. It’s not revered, “earned”. The Oakland A’s in the moneyball era were “smart”, shrewd with their payroll, and developed a team/culture. I really to believe that’s what is at the heart of this debate.
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Discussion Topic: Tom Ryan Flo interview.
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on April 14, 2024
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I'm old enough to remember when Howard Ferguson stepped in at St Eds in the mid 1970's. He had helped put in place a great youth system on Cleveland's west side and he just started funneling talent into his program. In three years, Eds won a state title and they've never looked back.
At the time, every area school in NE Ohio had it's share of tough kids. Taken a step further, the Cleveland area had not only the best high school wrestling in the state but arguably the country. Only western PA could rival the Cleveland area.
No one was happy about St Eds ability to enroll the best youth talent in the area or accept transfers. Other coaches despised Ferguson and crowds cheered when Eds kids lost.
Howard Ferguson understood how a private school could take advantage of the rules at the time and gain a competitive advantage over public school programs with geographical boundaries. Remember "open enrollment" didn't exist.
The rules never changed. Eds remains a powerhouse to this day.
I'm sympathetic to Tom Ryan's point of view. But he's going to have to figure out how to play this new game or likely slide into a permanent disadvantage when competing with programs that have access to more NIL money.
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