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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Rex Holman added to this discussion on September 5, 2024
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I would argue that it is just gaming the system and allowing your wrestler to compete against less developed wrestlers for longer.
It feels like winning a state championship (or 4) is what it is really about.
Anyway, another topic worthy of discussion.
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on September 6, 2024
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Here is a video from persuit wrestling that got Carter Starroccis attention. An ex buckeye wrestler Braken Mead runs it and urges every single wrestler to be held back.
https://x.com/PursuitWrestlin/status/1829174352706973970
If you aren’t being held back you are almost at a disadvantage these days. You are trading a 15 year old season for a 19 year old season.
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Jack Muni added to this discussion on September 6, 2024
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$1.3 million to wrestle one more year? Wow, that's insane!
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Rex Holman added to this discussion on September 6, 2024
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"If you aren’t being held back you are almost at a disadvantage these days. "
Absolutely, there are multiple ways to gain an edge on the competition. This being one of the significant ones.
Strength and club coaching in the sport of wrestling matters. Wrestlers that get held back a year get the benefit of an additional year of strength and wrestling development and have an advantage over kids that don't.
Typically, I don't care what people do, but if you are going to play the game then some admission of age needs to accompany the titular freshman, sophomore, junior, senior designation.
Newsflash, they actually allow for a redshirt year at the next level in cases of developmental lag.
Just looking for that edge.
I have a ton of respect for kids that start later in the sport and electively wrestle.
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on September 6, 2024
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Nothing takes the place of sheer athleticism. Most successful wrestlers are pretty good athletes but the great ones are usually faster, stronger and more well balanced. There are plenty of wrestlers who started late but became fantastic quickly for this reason.
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
J.P. Barner added to this discussion on September 6, 2024
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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"Nothing takes the place of sheer athleticism. Most successful wrestlers are pretty good athletes but the great ones are usually faster, stronger and more well balanced. There are plenty of wrestlers who started late but became fantastic quickly for this reason."
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This certainly explains why I sucked at it. :)
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Brian Mathews added to this discussion on September 6, 2024
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IMO holding back *solely* for the purpose of high school athletic competition is pathetic.
Even with money involved, the top 1% of D1 wrestlers (who are already an extremely small percentage of the high school pool) are the only guys making meaningful amounts.
If you're good enough to reach that tier, one more year in high school isn't going to be the difference.
Your friends are dispersing, starting on the path toward adulthood. And you're... what? Sticking around your high school, hoping to wring an extra $25k from some faceless booster? Then you're going to take a redshirt in college. Maybe a medical redshirt too, since you've probably already wrestled 10,000 matches and your body is starting to fall apart. Maybe you go on to be an All-American a couple times. Make a little scratch. Now you're graduating as a 25 year old with two degrees that you're not even going to use, and you're just going to go coach wrestling anyway. But hey, you've got a little money saved up, right?
It's all a bit sad.
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Ethan Moore added to this discussion on September 7, 2024
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Brian - totally agree but you said it better than I could.
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on September 8, 2024
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Quote from Brian Mathews's post:
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"It's all a bit sad."
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Sad for who?
Maybe they think the life chosen by you (or me) is sad.
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on September 9, 2024
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Quote from Brady Hiatt's post:
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"
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Quote from Brian Mathews's post:
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"It's all a bit sad."
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Sad for who?
Maybe they think the life chosen by you (or me) is sad."
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When I finished college, my only ambition was to get involved in coaching wrestling. The jobs I worked didn't pay much but my schedule allowed me to scratch that itch for 14 years. It cost me in terms of financial savings. But I don't regret it. I was able to lead my team to a 4th place finish at the state meet including two state champions. And I have life long bonds with a variety of young men. My only regret is that I didn't do more to positively influence the kids I coached. Because that's more important than winning. Ideally, you do both. I tried.
You can always make money. And people often take years to find their career paths.
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Brian Mathews added to this discussion on September 9, 2024
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Quote from Brady Hiatt's post:
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"
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Quote from Brian Mathews's post:
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"It's all a bit sad."
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Sad for who?
Maybe they think the life chosen by you (or me) is sad."
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I should clarify--I am not saying coaching wrestling, attending college for a couple extra years, or earning degrees, are sad.
What I think is sad is that we have a system that increasingly incentivizes people to skirt rules. I know people have always done these things, but with the money that's involved now it's only intensified.
Would any of us approve of a 15 year old taking HGH as a performance enhancer? If not, then why is anyone OK with a 17 year old high school freshman--or 20 year old high school senior?
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on September 9, 2024
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Quote from Brian Mathews's post:
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"Would any of us approve of a 15 year old taking HGH as a performance enhancer? If not, then why is anyone OK with a 17 year old high school freshman--or 20 year old high school senior?"
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Can't be 20 and compete in HS.
I think HGH and being held back are two vastly different things.
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on September 10, 2024
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I don't have a passionate opinion one way or the other on the holdback issue, other than to say it works to give athletes an advantage over athletes that don't get held back. It would seem to me that the freedom to make decisions for one's family should be left up to the family, but I'm wrong a lot.
My question for this particular discussion is, when did following the rules become "skirting the rules"? A rule is put in place, people follow the rule to the letter and then others consider them cheaters. It escapes me?
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Shawn Andrews added to this discussion on September 10, 2024
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I have lots of thoughts about this issue but the one that keeps coming to mind is the phrase "hold back" your athlete. Once again we continue to create this myopic approach when dealing with 5,6 and 7 year olds or 5th,6th and 7th graders is about their athletic endeavors rather than their academic or who they become as people
From and educational perspective students who are truly behind academically see very little benefit in repeating a grade, in fact the social/emotional impact is more inherently negative than any positives that are gained.
If as a parent you decide from a maturity perspective to start them late or do an alt-k and Kindergarten year because you think they need more time to mature and be ready to sit in school all day I think that is fair. If you are making athletic minded decisions around kindergarten enrolment it seems folly.
In the end there are certainly some individuals who have had success at the High School/College level who benefited from a year of growth and physical maturity, but is that due to correlation or causation? I might question how did they success parley into future opportunities? In the long term view of their life what did they gain? Did they get opportunity at a university that wouldn't have had otherwise? Did they garner some sort of additional financial opportunity as a result of their extra year in school?
I am not here to demonize those who have made the choice, merely question is it worth it. Every parent wants to believe that their kid is the next phenom but statistically we know that can't be true.
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Discussion Topic: Reclassing for Wrestling
Brian Mathews added to this discussion on September 10, 2024
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Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:
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"My question for this particular discussion is, when did following the rules become "skirting the rules"? A rule is put in place, people follow the rule to the letter and then others consider them cheaters. It escapes me?"
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I was speaking of skirting rules in the context of the broader wrestling landscape. Holding a kid back isn't really against the rules, even if I disagree with people doing it.
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