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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Jeff Mowrer added to this discussion on December 18, 2024
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Pretty eventful day for sure and glad Rocco is staying. Likely a costly mistake on Ryan's part in NIL dollars which isn't unlimited. Hope he learns from this and navigates the new landscape more deftly.
Will be interesting if a Kharchla wrestle off is part of the deal. Rocco wants to compete at 174.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on December 18, 2024
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Yes this definitely cost the buckeyes valuable Nil dollars that were probably saved after Marcus Blaze decided elsewhere. . Going to need all the money available to land a guy like Bassett. When rumors first started I knew the only player for Rocco was more than likely going to be Oklahoma state. Penn state and Iowa are loaded at 174/184. Penn state has Ryder/Barr/Haines. Iowa has Ferrari and Arnold. I’m just glad those two teams are completely set at his weight so a bigger bidding war didn’t ensue.
As which weight he wrestles and if he wrestles this year is now in Rocco’s control. I wonder what his plans is at this point in the year. If he goes 174can Carson go 184 or 165? A healthy Carson kharchla is not a gaurentee win either. A healthy Carson was a bad call away from beating otoole at the NCAA tournament. The best lineup is to have both these guys wrestle.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Brian Mathews added to this discussion on December 18, 2024
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The reality is that every single guy in the lineup can test their market value at any time of their own choosing.
Every year is an opportunity to renegotiate. Anyone with a redshirt to burn can effectively act as a free agent in-season.
If you're redshirting a guy, you're paying him real dollars for future performance which may or may not materialize.
The coaches have to be mindful of what every guy is getting paid each year to make sure they're close enough to market to incentivize that guy to stay. A little too stingy, and you risk more situations like this in the future.
Not an enviable position to be in.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on December 18, 2024
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According to Jeff Mowrer, Welsh was upset about not being allowed to compete. Did this turn into an NIL issue in addition? Maybe. But first and foremost it seems Tom Ryan got away from a core belief that you let the best wrestlers compete. I know I'm beating a dead horse here, but, assuming Jeff's correct, and it seems like he is, the problem was asking Welsh to redshirt.
My question is why? Were they saving a spot for Kharchla? Did they want Welsh to wait for 184 to clear out (if he was indeed moving up)? Whatever the reason, I don't really get the point in redshirting arguably the second best wrestler on your squad.
And what happens next season if Mendez stays at 141? Do you ask Mendez to redshirt so you can squeeze Davino and Bouzakis into the lineup?
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Rick Wasmer added to this discussion on December 18, 2024
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Quote from Jim Kessen's post:
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"Being reported on Bucknuts Geog tore his groin and is out for season.
I’m curious what weight Welsh wants to wrestle. Rumors he walks around at 205/10."
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That's too bad about Geog, he had obviously made a big jump.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Brady Hiatt added to this discussion on December 18, 2024
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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Quote from Brady Hiatt's post:
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Quote from Hank Kornblut's post:
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"Tom Ryan was always a proponent of putting his best lineup on the mat. Now's the time to stick with that philosophy."
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With Starocci and Keck at 184, I can't see that being a wise decision (if Rocco is a 184)."
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Is winning a NCAA title all it's about?"
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Those guys want to win. With Star and Keck gone, it is much more open. AND I think the team is stronger next year as well.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Drew Taylor added to this discussion on December 18, 2024
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Geog is expected to return this season, Rick.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Rex Holman added to this discussion on December 19, 2024
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Coaching has to change with the times and the variables at play.
NIL is a new thing that is evolving.
A couple years ago, the idea of redshirting and looking out a couple years at a team title was a thing.
With this paradigm shift, you have to look at the right now.
Looking from the outside, those are plausible explanations.
Sit Rocco, let Keckeisen and Starocci clear out, much clearer path to 3 titles.
Also, loyalty to Kharchla could very well be a thing. He is a skilled performer with excellent placement potential minus the proclivity for injury.
There are a lot of intelligent people that contribute to this site. Let's not attack each other when someone comes to the discussion with new information. Jeff came in with excellent info and was told he was wrong. He was right.
The facts will eventually become known and speak for themselves.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Rick Wasmer added to this discussion on December 19, 2024
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Quote from Drew Taylor's post:
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"Geog is expected to return this season, Rick."
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Good news for sure. I was enjoying watching his matches. Seemed like a huge improvement from last year.
Paddy also has stepped up in a big way.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on December 20, 2024
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According to Tom Ryan the information was inaccurate Rex
From Flo:
He was never leaving,” Ohio State coach Tom Ryan said. “There’s just mis-assessing or misrepresenting the situation.”
Ryan said he presented Welsh with three options for his second season with the program. On Nov. 2 — the day before the Buckeyes opened the season at the Clarion Open — Ryan said he had a conversation with Welsh and laid out those three options.
Welsh could compete for the 174-pound starting job against 2022 All-American Carson Kharchla, who was working his way back from a leg injury that ended his 2024 season. But that wrestle-off would have to wait until December when Kharchla was ready to return to competition.
“What made (that option) challenging was Carson was out until December and Carson has no redshirt and Rocco does,” Ryan said. “So if we have a redshirt (at your disposal) and you lose (the wrestle-off), your redshirt is gone because you’ve been wrestling (in the lineup) up until December. Basically, the timing of the wrestle-off — if we had one — it couldn’t happen until December because Carson is recovering from a leg injury from last year. So we had to discuss that. If you want to go ‘74, you can. You’ll have to wrestle-off for the spot, which he’s fine with.”
The second option Ryan presented to Welsh was moving up to 184 “because you’re huge, you’re big and strong.”
The third choice is the one Welsh has chosen, according to Ryan — utilizing his redshirt season.
The best thing for him is to redshirt,” Ryan said. “The best thing for the team long-term is for him to redshirt.”
Somewhere along the line, however, online rumors began circulating that Welsh wasn’t being allowed to wrestle-off for the 174-pound spot. Ryan called those posts “negligent reporting” and “very damaging and very unhealthy.”
Those posts sparked the speculation that Welsh might be looking to leave Ohio State.
“He doesn’t need to stay here,” Ryan said. “He can go wherever he wants and people would pay a lot of money for him. That’s the day and age we’re in. He stayed because he has a foundation of trust and he’s connected to people here that he wants to be with. That’s why elite people stay. There’s confidence and there’s connection.”
Like I said no way Tom Ryan would give Welsh no option to wrestle off.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Rex Holman added to this discussion on December 20, 2024
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Ok. Where I am coming from.
Did Rocco visit Stillwater? If no, then you are right.
If he visited, then actions speak otherwise.
It's most likely that he was checking out what and how much it had to offer.
You don't do that unless you are toying with the idea or checking out your market valuation.
Also, when you run a program; rumors or facts can derail the mission. So, there is that. Really important to get out ahead of that stuff.
Just my opinion.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on December 20, 2024
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Rex whether he visited Oklahoma state or not I am not sure. I would guess he did because Tom Ryan never mentioned he didn’t. I believe this was probably to see his market value for nil. Reports started coming out after people heard about what Ohio state offered Marcus Blaze that Rocco was unhappy. He may have been unhappy because he was a returning NCAA runner up and getting much less $$$ as a proven college wrestler than what Marcus blaze was going to get and felt disrespected. I have no inside information on this but maybe that played a role. The exact same thing happened at Iowa with Ayala getting less as a runner up than transfer portal guys.
What I was certain of was that Tom Ryan did not demand him to redshirt. As I said earlier on here Tom sat him down and gave him the choice. Rocco chose to redshirt. I don't think anyone considers Tom Ryan a liar and if he says he did he wouldn’t publicly lie about it. This seems to be a NIL issue and looks like Rocco got paid.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on December 20, 2024
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Quote from Nick Lecklider's post:
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"Pat mineo is not a good source. He is a troll that likes to stir things up. He is wrong all the time.
I don’t believe this for a second. A coach’s job is to sit down and communicate with the wrestler what their plan/goals are for the year. If Rocco wanted to wrestle there is absolutely no way Tom Ryan would stop him. Rocco has earned the right to make that decision. To make him so mad he would transfer out would be ridiculous."
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This was my original argument.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Jeff Mowrer added to this discussion on December 20, 2024
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You can't blame Tom for the spin. It was necessary though not entirely true. If his nose appears a little longer next time we see him you'll know why. ;)
But it's water under the bridge now as Rocco is staying. That's the important part.
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Discussion Topic: Rocco Welsh Rumors
Alex Creech added to this discussion on December 20, 2024
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Quote from Jeff Mowrer's post:
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"You can't blame Tom for the spin. It was necessary though not entirely true. If his nose appears a little longer next time we see him you'll know why. ;)
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This really needs to stop. It's a bad look.
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