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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Scott Nicola added to this discussion on July 13, 2007
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I am excited to see this match between 2 of the most physical wrestlers in the nation. Palmer's sucess as a true freshman is well documented while Metcalf has been competitive on the senior level freestyle circuit. I tend to think that Metcalf holds the advantage on their feet while Palmer is the better mat wrestler (particularly with Metcalf concentrating on FS for the past year). I know one thing, when these 2 match up therer will be very little backing up.
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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on July 14, 2007
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I've talked to some VERY intelligible guys about this. Even tonight we were throwing it around. Some say he can do it, others say he loses. One guy suggested Palmer gets majored!!! (But then again, that same guy is still angry Brian Brakeman all but made fun of him in his finals match. <smile> )
I'll say this... I see NO reason why he can't beat Metcalf, as well as the rest of the 149 pound weight class. They'll see each other enough times to figure something out. Never underestimate a Palmer AND never underestimate tNDG and Co.!!! <--- That's all I'm saying!
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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Brian Nicola added to this discussion on July 14, 2007
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Right now, I think Metcalf is the more complete wrestler...HOWEVER...I think Ryan is a better coach than Brands. Palmer CAN close the gap. Will he? We shall see.
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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on July 14, 2007
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Brent Metcalf is a physical freak. He's incredibly strong and seems to have as much power in his legs as his upper body. To beat him requires a great deal of technique and conditioning. Plus, he's going to be relentless for 7 minutes.
Lance would have to defend Metcalf's attacks--particularly his vaunted underhook offense--while getting in on his own shots. Those underhooks could be a big problem as Metcalf has the power to jack up Lance. On the other hand, Lance is short enough to get in on Metcalf's legs--which most taller wrestlers can't do because Metcalf is a bit short himself.
I think Lance would have to do something few can do to beat Metcalf and that's to put him on the defensive in order to slow him down. Then, of course, he has to keep him down from top position which is almost impossible.
Just my 2 pennies....
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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Dan Ransick added to this discussion on July 14, 2007
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I don't know if Metcalf could get out from under Palmer. Schlatter didn't even choose down against Palmer knowing how tough is on top.
Palmer is very tough on his feet and the matches I saw last year of him he was able to get some big takedowns when it mattered.
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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on July 15, 2007
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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on July 15, 2007
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Can you explain your 5-1? Are you talking an escape and 4 stalling points to one TV??? Or are you saying two takedowns and an escape vs. just an escape?
Not that you have to nail it exactly but I was wondering how you thought the scoeing would go. Do you think they are early points or a constant build up to it climaxing to a five-pointer in the end? (I doubt that is the case, but I thought I'd "throw" it out there.)
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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on July 16, 2007
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OK, let me start by saying that I'd be an idiot not to acknowledge how obviously great Lance Palmer is. 4th as a true-frosh is an impressive feat, and it's not like the difference between him and the guys ahead of him was great. We're talking about a couple of points. He's on his way to having a spectacular career. Many of us on these forums thought he needed a red-shirt year to improve his takedown skill to be an effective college wrestler and we were clearly
DEAD WRONG
.
That being said, I think Metcalf is a bad match-up for him. A guy just as strong or stronger. A guy with very sound defence who comes forward the entire match. He's not all brute force either, he's got great scambling ability as well. Add to that very good quicks and an attitude of agression with a chip on his shoulder about the past two years.
As great as Palmer's mat skills are, he's not going to turn the best in the country (I don't see him turning Metcalf). This match will be decided on their feet, and I don't see Metcalf wrestling Palmer the way many others have. For better or worse, Metcalf is going to at you, he's going to take the match to his opponent. I don't think a lot of 49-pounders did that last year with Palmer (probably easier said then done).
Take his match with Schlatter. Schlatter did exactly what it took to win, no more, no less. Someone above mentioned Schlatter not taking down. Why would he? He didn't need that point. I'm not sure if Palmer is one point away from Schlatter, but that's how Schlatter wrestled the bout (and many bouts last season). I just don't see Metcalf wrestling anyone, particularly a returning AA like that. It's going to be push-outs and head-butts and Brands/Gable wrestling.
Niemann...To answer you question, I see the match as an escape each, with one takedown for Metcalf (someting on the edge). Then, with the clock running down, Palmer gets taken down late trying to tie it up.
I would like to say that I am looking at this from where I saw these guys last. Palmer at NCAAs and Metcalf at US Nationals. It is certainly possible that Palmer keeps this ridiculous rate of imrovement up and comes out next season as a world-beater. At that point I would have to re-assess.
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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on July 16, 2007
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"Niemann...To answer you question, I see the match as an escape each, with one takedown for Metcalf (someting on the edge). Then, with the clock running down, Palmer gets taken down late trying to tie it up."
That is what I was looking for. I can see this being the case. I can also see Palmer pinning him!!! <excited> j/k
<sign_oh>
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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Gary Corroto added to this discussion on July 16, 2007
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I would never bet against Lance. He just finds ways to win. One of Lance's strenghts is that he keeps matches close. Lance does a great job in always maintaining great position; therefore when he wrestles against top competition he is always in the match giving himslef a chance to win at the end. I think the matchup with Meltcalf is very interesting because they are both brawlers. I do not see Lance turning Metcalf. Also I wouldn't put too much stock in Schlatter not choosing down against Lance. Remember Schlatter was battling a knee injury at the time. He wasn't choosing down against anybody because of the strain it would put on his knee. I am not saying that he still would not have picked neutral against Lance, just that I wouldn't read too much into that decision.
I actually think Churella may be a tougher match up for both Lance and Metcalf because of Churella's style. There are going to be some great match-ups at 149 next year and Lance is definetly going. to be in the hunt for the title.
PS - Bubba Jenkins from Penn State will most likely be down at 149 this year. He will also make things interesting with his speed and athleticism.
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Discussion Topic: Lance Palmer v. Brent Metcalf
Steve Lester added to this discussion on July 17, 2007
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"Then, of course, he has to keep him down from top position which is almost impossible."
I wonder. Dustin rode Metcalf out most of the first period at senior nationals and at the Dapper Dan, Matt Dragon actually turned Metcalf, much to my disbelief. I think Lance can ride Metcalf, if not turn him.
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