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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 6, 2008
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His match with Porter surprised me as I would not have believed he could dominate without hitting a big move--yet that's exactly what he did. He looked strong, confident and fit as he wore out the huge Porter and beat him badly.
At 197, he was often an unimpressive winner (albeit a 2x All American). At 285, he's the competitor we all knew he could be. Active, confident and scoring at every opportunity.
No guarantees that he wins it in March. But he's at the right weight class to do it. And he's good enough. No question.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Roe Fox added to this discussion on January 6, 2008
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Hank: Agreed. I was stunned he took a few shots on the legs against a guy who could lay on him and put him in a bad spot. He seems to have an out when he gets in and doesn't finish. His match with Dustin Fox (no relation) is much anticipated. I thought he would have some difficulty against a good wrestler the size of Porter. He has a great shot at the title.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Dan Cosimi added to this discussion on January 6, 2008
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I completely agree. He's got all the tools to run the table and win the national championship. In fact he's my pick to win it. Will he? Only time will tell. He's scheduled to meet undefeated #1 Dustin Fox three times (dual, Big 10 tournament, NCAA tournament) and each bout should be very close.
Interesting notes about success at higher weights...
- I believe that it is because Bergman is competing at 285 that he's having this much success. At 197 he would be a title contender but wouldn't be this dominating and probably wouldn't be the favorite at this point in the season (I think defending champion Glenn is still undefeated).
- Mike Pucillo enjoyed great success at 184 last year when many said he could easily cut to 174. With the open spot at 174 this year, some still speculated that it would be him (not Picazo) who would drop to the lower weight class. He didn't drop the unneeded weight and he's a better wrestler for it.
- As a high school senior, Lance Palmer won the senior national championship at 140 pounds. Nine pounds up and not even nine months later, he was on his way to an All-American season as a true freshman.
As bumped-up NCAA champions Josh Glenn and Shane Webster might tell you, cutting too much weight hurts performance. Building up to a healthy weight (where you are still big enough to compete well) improves performance. There aren't too many recent examples of wrestlers building themselves up a weight class and not doing as well there. At the high school level, think of some of Ohio's recent senior national champs... Mike Pucillo (152 as a junior, 189 as a senior)... Joe Dennis (171 as a junior, 215 as a senior)... or even stars from today... Zach Toal placed third in the state as a freshman at 112 pounds. As a sophomore last year, he bumped up to 140 pounds and upset state champion Josh Falk three times in three matchups, including the state championship bout... Kyle Lang, who was at 112 last year, bumped up to 140 pounds after competing at 135 at the Ironman. At 140 he won by major decision for third place at the Beast of the East and placed high at Brecksville, losing in overtime to the champion Habat (who just came down from 145) in the semifinals.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Warren Edwards added to this discussion on January 6, 2008
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More kids involved in this sport need to hear about those kind of successes. <strong>
Cutting isn't the answer so many think it is.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 7, 2008
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Quote from W.T. Edwards's post:
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"More kids involved in this sport need to hear about those kind of successes. <strong>
Cutting isn't the answer so many think it is."
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The Russians never do it. They lift up to the next weight class. Think they know something? They've been the best freestylers in the world for the last 40 years.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Ben Roerig added to this discussion on January 7, 2008
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On the other end of the spectrum there are guys like T.J. Enright and Mark Perry who go up a weight class and do not match the success they had at the lower weight. The reason behind Perry's lack of success (if you can call 3rd place at the NCAA's a lack of success?) is rather obvious as two guys by the names of Askren and Herbert were at his weight class. In all honestly Perry looks like a small 165 pounder, let alone a 174 pounder. In Enright's case his body is probably more suited to that of a 133 pounder due to his compact build, although he didn's seem to have too much trouble with the "lengthy" Nick Simmons and his strength is definitely a big advantage at the lower weight class.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Dan Cosimi added to this discussion on January 7, 2008
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Ben:
I'm going to disagree here. Perry didn't have a lack of success at 174, he just ran into buzzsaws Askren and Herbert. That has absolutely nothing to do with Perry's weight and everything to do with Askren and Herbert's talent. In fact, Perry's losses to Dieffenbach and the Old Dominion wrestler are counter to your point. Though it is not even close to crunch time yet, it could argued very well that he's not doing as well at 165 as he did at 174. As for Enright, either he wasn't big enough for 141 or I think he would have better success there.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 7, 2008
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Quote from Dan Cosimi's post:
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"Ben:
I'm going to disagree here. Perry didn't have a lack of success at 174, he just ran into buzzsaws Askren and Herbert. That has absolutely nothing to do with Perry's weight and everything to do with Askren and Herbert's talent. In fact, Perry's losses to Dieffenbach and the Old Dominion wrestler are counter to your point. Though it is not even close to crunch time yet, it could argued very well that he's not doing as well at 165 as he did at 174. As for Enright, either he wasn't big enough for 141 or I think he would have better success there."
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...except he was National Champ last year at 165.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Ben Roerig added to this discussion on January 7, 2008
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Hank,
Completely ageed in regard to Perry, who recently claimed that inproper weight cutting was among the reasons he did so poorly in his recent match vs. Dieffenbach, another support for your arguement. Although, I still think Gavin of Pitt would beat Perry. If Gavin can finish a shot on the ultimate funkster, Askren, I believe he would be able to do the same to Perry, whose offense is very limited when he is the one forced to press the action and take a shot. I completely agree with your main point, I just believe there will always be an outlier. I love nothing more than seeing someone moving up a weight and being successfull. Weight-cutting has long been a blackeye on the sport in the eyes of the casual wrestling observer and nothing makes me happier than seeing Joe Dennis do a belly jiggle to prove one doesn't need to cut after winning senior nationals, or watching Pucillo dominate yet another shredded 184.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 8, 2008
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Actually, I don't disagree with DC. I was just being argumentative <smile>
I think there are obvious examples of steep wt cuts hurting wrestlers--particularly in duals where there is less recovery time than tournies. The proliferation of wrestling video has allowed all of us to see remarkable talents look incredibly ordinary such as Perry. Incidentally, I think he makes his cut for his team and I also think the same is true of Dustin. Dustin has gone from offensive juggernaut to conservative match manager. (I look for him to move up next season and recapture his brilliance; his matchups with the superb Mike Poeta should be epic but I think Dustin will prove to be better).
Now for my daily Sponseller plug: In a dual meet with Iowa, I like his odds very much against Perry. In fact, if I'm Tom Ryan, I'd try and make it the first bout of the night to limit Perry's recovery time even further.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Dan Ransick added to this discussion on January 8, 2008
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Hank nice Sponseller plug there. Perry is really cutting to much weight and it is showing in his performance this year. He is doing it for the team like you said so Borschel can be in the lineup. I do like Sponseller's chances there with his unlimited gas tank and ability to break opponents.
Bergman is just showing us all what he can do when not cutting weight. I think more and more people are realizing this now on the college level and moving up in weight classes and the results are speaking for themselves.
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Discussion Topic: J.D. Bergman
Ben Roerig added to this discussion on January 8, 2008
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Bergman's Flo interview is funny, as well as a good plug for NOT cutting weight. I'm glad that he kept emphasizing that cutting weight was never a big deal, although I suspect differently ... but still a good thing to say.
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