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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Rex Holman added to this discussion on January 20, 2024
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Ben Golden added to this discussion on January 20, 2024
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He's not a true freshman, right? He transferred in from Cal Baptist, where he was a true frosh last year.
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Alex Creech added to this discussion on January 20, 2024
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Quote from Ben Golden's post:
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"He's not a true freshman, right? He transferred in from Cal Baptist, where he was a true frosh last year."
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Correct. he's also 21.
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Justin Hayes added to this discussion on January 21, 2024
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What do you like/see, Rex?
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Rex Holman added to this discussion on January 21, 2024
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I don't follow much high school wrestling although that's changing.
Yes, if he's 21 and a redshirt; that's 3rd year college in a time gone by.
So, he does look like extremely complete wrestler capable of wrestling nonstop.
The performances look like a hybrid of Jason Nolf and Carter Starrocci.
Why so good?
His forward movement. He maintains forward progress.
He stalks on the edge. As effective as anyone I've seen. Most people wrestle different on the edge and not in a productive way. He is the exact opposite. He is methodically going about breaking his opponent's position on the edge in a very smart way.
Changing back and forth between loose tie and controlled tie wrestling. It's very confusing to his opponent and will result in bad reactions by his opponent.
High pace that is not quite a sprint as he is relaxed and able to maintain it throughout the course of a match.
Nonstop, productive and efficient movements.
Still accountable to head and hands defense if opponent should attempt to attack.
So, the dynamic of all those aspects coming together as one cohesive force is just awesome.
What he did to Amine was something new to me. Amine has a slow controlled style and outcome is dependent upon one score. He legitimately exposed Amine and referee awarded four stalling points.
Most wrestlers don't wrestle at that pace because they don't find it to be economical in terms of training and scoring, so they go the more measured and conservative route. Also, I would say his pace is maybe a tick or two above other PSU wrestlers that wrestle at high pace.
Anyone know why Cal Baptist?
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on January 21, 2024
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Mesenbrink was not a major recruit when Cal Baptist offered him. Then he went on a tear. World Title....Fargo...a number of impressive wins. I'm sure my details are a bit foggy but you get the gist.
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Jack Muni added to this discussion on January 21, 2024
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I look forward to seeing him wrestle another Arrowhead High School grad, Keegan O'Toole.
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Justin Hayes added to this discussion on January 21, 2024
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Has he lost this season? What does it take to beat a wrestler of this caliber/approach?
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Jim Behrens added to this discussion on January 21, 2024
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" He legitimately exposed Amine and referee awarded four stalling points."
IMO, he could have (and maybe should have) been stalled out. There were 5 or 6 places where Angel could have easily tagged him. He spent more time at the boundary line than he did in the center of the mat.
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Brian Mathews added to this discussion on January 23, 2024
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Mesenbrink is tremendous. Not a true freshman, as already mentioned, but he’s damn impressive for a RS freshman anyway.
Better than Nickal, Nolf or Taylor… not sure about that. Those guys ended their RS freshmen years with 1 or 2 losses and bonus rates north of 70%. They also wrestled a more demanding schedule at that time.
Don’t want to downplay what Mesenbrink has done lately, as it’s impressive, but Mendez has also majored and pinned prior all Americans this year, and they’re contemporaries.
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Rex Holman added to this discussion on January 23, 2024
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Rewatched a couple of times.
I like to study matches that are special.
He is predominantly right lead leg with collar wrist tie but smoothly transitions to left lead with a neutral outside tie (not deep). He doesn't stay in a tie long as he is attempting to create more reactions.
As coaches we can teach tie ups to both sides that our wrestlers can transition back and forth from which they will generate progressions of attacks.
This is advanced but can be scaled up. Just have to incorporate the smaller pieces of the attack and then marry them together as the positions are mastered.
So, the rapidity of attacks is counterintuitive and can only be accomplished through drilling and getting the wrestler accustomed to attack in this way.
What you see with younger guys and is evident when you been around wrestling for a while. Attacking is met by punishment because position is compromised when you attack an older wiser wrestler.
However, you can turn this paradigm on its head if you focus on the set ups and movements which don't allow an established wrestler to stay in position from which they are comfortable. Constantly working to set up and move the opponent in an effort to move them out of position. This is accomplished by what you see out of Messenbrink. Both sides. Controlled ties and loose ties. Get a reaction and continue into the next tie up, fake or attack.
A lot of wrestling practices can be too long and require too much drivel, which is a recipe for mediocrioty.
I talk about end driven goals and wrestling. This is exactly that. Set your practices up to get your wrestlers to wrestle in such a way that creates action by attacking both sides and is meant to break position. Otherwise, wrestlers will get use to standing around and maintaining position and encouraging a slow pace.
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Rex Holman added to this discussion on January 23, 2024
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And yes, Jesse is killing it this year.
His wrestling is more conventional and excellent.
I want wrestling to continue this route that I see Messenbrink accomplish. I would have loved to have a coach explain it in the terms I do and break it down in a way to accomplish that task.
I don't know if it is sustainable. It might be. Not sure. Certainly not with training that focuses on the wrong things. Like 8 matches or 16x300s, but that wasn't sustainable either :)
Jim-
I agree could've stalled him out but let him save face in front of the home crowd.
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on January 23, 2024
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Messenbrink was very close to becoming a buckeye. Tom Ryan in an off-season interview said they didn’t think it was worth bringing in someone and use Nil money to get someone who would score maybe just a couple more points at ncaas. Looking like 15-20 more points. I think Tom has too much confidence in his roster as he thought everyone would be a top 10 type wrestler he said in the offseason. I think he is afraid of making tough decisions and recruiting over someone. If Tom doesn’t use the portal they will never beat Penn state and Iowa and Michigan. Portal are kids that are NCAA proven. Recruiting high schoolers alone will not do it anymore. They need to address team weaknesses and build a roster. Rocco, bouzakis, mendes, Feldman, and I believe davino are a strong core but you will need to build around them where you can. I wouldn’t be surprised if davino could beat bouzakis next year as I think he is that good. Demilio is basically the only veteran. Rest of the roster I believe needs to prove themselves at the end of this season and Tom needs to give a fair assessment and maybe make tough choices.
Just look what the football team did this offseason. They definitely won the best portal off-season and the new athletic director seems to be a much bigger NIL guy than gene smith.
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Nick Lecklider added to this discussion on January 23, 2024
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Messenbrink was very close to becoming a buckeye. Tom Ryan in an off-season interview said they didn’t think it was worth bringing in someone and use Nil money to get someone who would score maybe just a couple more points at ncaas. Looking like 15-20 more points. I think Tom has too much confidence in his roster as he thought everyone would be a top 10 type wrestler he said in the offseason. I think he is afraid of making tough decisions and recruiting over someone. If Tom doesn’t use the portal they will never beat Penn state and Iowa and Michigan. Portal are kids that are NCAA proven. Recruiting high schoolers alone will not do it anymore. They need to address team weaknesses and build a roster. Rocco, bouzakis, mendes, Feldman, and I believe davino are a strong core but you will need to build around them where you can. I wouldn’t be surprised if davino could beat bouzakis next year as I think he is that good. Demilio is basically the only veteran. Rest of the roster I believe needs to prove themselves at the end of this season and Tom needs to give a fair assessment and maybe make tough choices.
Just look what the football team did this offseason. They definitely won the best portal off-season and the new athletic director seems to be a much bigger NIL guy than gene smith.
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Discussion Topic: Messenbrink
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on January 23, 2024
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MINN 2001 is the standard. Personal opinion.
Recruit. Develop. Win.
Wash, rinse, repeat.
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